Read your parents' wills!

[Owly]

I discovered to my horror today that my Dad's will has Mum as sole executrix, unless she is dead when I and my siblings become executors. My Mum has dementia. She always led me to believe that I and my siblings were executors and I never checked the will.

We are seeing the solicitor next week so my Dad can write a new will.

What would have happened if Dad had died in the meantime (or before the new will is signed)? Would the COP have needed to get involved? I have POA for Mum. Would that have given me the right to stand in as Executrix?

My Mum's will has me and my Dad as joint executors. What would happen though if Dad developed dementia too and then Mum died? Would I just carry on as sole executor?

Thank you for your help.

 

[starryuk]

Hi Owly,

This doesn't apply to me, but a good reminder for us even if we are thinking of our own wills.

Thanks for flagging it up. I am bumping up your post.

 

[scared daughter]

Yes very

 

[lin1]

Giving this another bump, as I too think it is important to sort out any possible problems like this , before it's too late.

Dad and I know all about each others wills, partially due to some right old c,ck ups the solicitor made in our wills, three times we had to hand them back , that's three times each for both of us !!

 

[Soobee]

Hi, I can only talk about my own experience here.

My mum and myself and my siblings were joint executors for my dad but because mum had dementia and was deemed not to have capacity we had a few problems.

When arranging probate, the Probate office asked for a copy of mum's LPA document, it seemed to satisfy them that we would be acting in her best interests. I was then able to be the Executor with powers reserved to my siblings and mum deemed as exempt.

There were some things we could not do (mainly around being Trustees and future beneficiaries) because mum could not agree to them but the day-to-day probate stuff was probably quite normal.

We couldn't transfer ownership of half of the share of the property because the Land Registry felt it was a conflict of interest us being Trustees with mum for half the house and future beneficiaries of the whole house. We were in the process of applying to the Court Of Protection to resolve this when mum died.

I hope that helps put your mind at rest.

 

[Soobee]

Giving this another bump, as I too think it is important to sort out any possible problems like this , before it's too late.

In my case the wills were okay but the solicitors didn't do their job properly and we had a potential negligence claim against them. We've spent thousands and much angst trying to put it right and they've only paid back 75% of the costs (this is quite usual for legal cases).

I would still recommend that people use a solicitor for their wills and LPAs despite my experience.

 

[nicoise]

Fortunately there is time for your dad to change his will and thus the executors.

Here is a link with some information which gives a guide if the person has died and the executor no longer has capacity:

http://www.barkerevansprivateclientlaw.co.uk/barkerblog/2013/02/mentalincapacityandexecutors/

An extract from this link:

One of the chief responsibilities of an executor is to apply for the issue of a grant of probate where one is required. If the executor is mentally incapable the probate registrar can issue the grant to someone other than the appointed executor but only if the registrar is satisfied that the executor is genuinely mentally incapacitated.

Once it has been established to the registrar’s satisfaction that the executor is mentally incapable the registrar is permitted either to issue the grant to someone who has been appointed by the Court of Protection to apply for the grant, or if there is no one authorised by the Court of Protection, then the grant can be issued to someone appointed to act as attorney for the executor under a registered enduring power of attorney or lasting power of attorney. Where there is no one falling within those categories or if someone who does fall within those categories decides they wish to renounce their right to the grant, then, the probate registrar is permitted to issue the grant to the person(s) entitled to the residuary estate of the deceased.

So the problem is not insurmountable, but of course these things always emerge just when least wanted!

 

[Owly]

Thank you for describing your experiences everyone, and Nicoise, thank you for the link and the excerpt. It looks as if my LPA for Mum might have sufficed but it would still have caused an additional layer of hassle getting proof from her memory doctor that she is now incapable.

 

[nicoise]

And prompted by this and my own experiences, today OH and I have set the ball rolling to get LPAs for ourselves underway (hopefully ) well in advance of needing them!

 

[PaulC10]

Father with dementia - Will appoints deceased mother as Executrix

Prompted by this thread, I've just taken a look at my Father's will and discovered that it appoints my late mother as sole executrix.

Dad has been resident in EMI Secure unit for past 6 months so - I expect - would be seen as lacking the mental capacity to vary the will and appoint an alternative Executor.

Does anyone know what effect how the fact that the appointed Executrix is no longer alive will have when my Dad passes and whether there's anything we can do now to ease the process?

(For whatever worth I would mention that as well as being appointed as Joint & Several Attornies for my Dad under an LPA , my brother & I are are also the only beneficiaries of the will - assets being divided on a 50/50 basis)

 

[nicoise]

Prompted by this thread, I've just taken a look at my Father's will and discovered that it appoints my late mother as sole executrix.

Dad has been resident in EMI Secure unit for past 6 months so - I expect - would be seen as lacking the mental capacity to vary the will and appoint an alternative Executor.

Does anyone know what effect how the fact that the appointed Executrix is no longer alive will have when my Dad passes and whether there's anything we can do now to ease the process?

(For whatever worth I would mention that as well as being appointed as Joint & Several Attornies for my Dad under an LPA , my brother & I are are also the only beneficiaries of the will - assets being divided on a 50/50 basis)

Contact your local Probate Office - this link should give a list:

http://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/probate

Tell them of the circumstances, and they should be able to advise you.

I believe a personal representative can be appointed to take over the role, but obviously there is an administrative process to follow.

 

[Saffie]

It didn't occur to either my husband nor myself to make each other executors of our Wills even though we made them over 25 years ago. We put our two daughters down instead.
I would have thought a solicitor would suggest this as there must always be a risk of a husband, wife or partner passing away first.

 

[Trisha4]

My husband and I had each other as executors in our wills. When my husband was diagnosed with Alzheimer's we were advised by our financial adviser to change my will naming our sons to avoid any chance of complications.

 

[WILLIAMR]

It didn't occur to either my husband nor myself to make each other executors of our Wills even though we made them over 25 years ago. We put our two daughters down instead.
I would have thought a solicitor would suggest this as there must always be a risk of a husband, wife or partner passing away first.

Hi Saffie

My parents put each other down as their executors and myself and my brother if neither of them were alive.
My brother died before both my parents. This illustrates children do not always outlast their parents.
My father was executor for my mothers will and I had to produce my brother's death certificate to act on my own with my father's will.

My will needs updating soon.
Something we are thinking about is myself, daughter's, son's in law and grandchildren travel on the same aeroplane or ferry every year.
There is a small chance we could all pass away at the same time.
We are going to ask the solicitor if in that event can a will be drawn up for the estate to go to other parts of the family and the other people in our family are thinking about doing the same thing.
I have 200+ relatives and it could be very complicated if all our estates have to be dealt with as intestate ones and could run up a lot of solicitors fees.

William