Power of Attorney - Current Account - Online Banking

[Forumite007]

Stanley:

(a) OPG in Scotland at least seems only to have a role in respect of individual cases, not campaigning or collective.

(b) if one or more other groups which do have collective responsibility start campaigning, I'd be delighted to know, and to lend my support when appropriate. Currently my hunch is that groups should gather individual cases, then the groups should band together, then approach the Ombudsman.

See Issue 37 of "Ombudsman News", which is encouraging (until you see it's from 2004 - have things got better since then or worse?!)

William

 

[stanleypj]

OPG in Scotland at least seems only to have a role in respect of individual cases, not campaigning or collective.

Thanks. I expect you're correct in that this is the current role and no doubt, as they struggle to fulfil it at the moment, they would not wish to have a wider role.

However, there's no reason why the role shouldn't be changed

 

[Forumite007]

However, there's no reason why the role shouldn't be changed

Indeed! - that'll be tomorrow's campaign

 

[zelana]

Interesting.

Given Lloyds and TSB are apparently going to split, and given my comment about HBOS <> H+BOS, which are you with - Lloyds or TSB?

At the moment both banks seem to be still running the same - I'm with one, Mum's accounts are with the other. The only thing that has changed so far is that new debit cards have been sent out for Mum's account although they don't actually look any different. I have a debit card on her account in my name and they also sent one here for Mum.

And are you going online as yourself, or as your Mum?

The details for setting up the online access were sent in my name but I had to use Mum's birth date to set the account up.

I have a cheque book for Mum's account which has my name "as POA for" Mum. The account has stayed in Mum's name but the statements & any other correspondence come c/o my address.

 

[Takemewithyou]

I'm POA for my mother and her account was with LLoyds. I had no problem sorting out the POA with them and am able to use internet banking on my mothers account.

The only issue I have is that they still insist on sending bank statements to my mothers care home as well as to me. Not sure that I like her having personal money information lying around, especially as she has dementia...doesn't seem too secure.

Otherwise, they've been great.

 

[Steevjo]

I'm a deputy looking after my dad's finances and in my experience the banks are awful at handling the situation. They have confused procedures, they don't train their staff and don't understand the stress they cause.

Notable exceptions - smile and ing direct - where everything just worked.

I've thought about the campaign idea and complained to the OPG but the reality is that people with LPAs and Deputyships usually have more important things to do with their time.

It will be a challenge but persevere and in most cases you can eventually find someone able to make things work - except at santander!

 

[slipperysam]

Hi, newbie here, going through the Power of attorney process on my parents accounts and thought I would share my experiences.

Mum and Dad have accounts with Santander and Nationwide.

Contrary to other experiences in this thread I have found Santander to be most helpful, the PoA process was simple and (as an existing Santander customer) when I log in online to my account I can see and operate my parents accounts.

With Nationwide the PoA process was more painful, with the forms getting lost in the system first time around so had to go back into branch and do it all again. The PoA's are now largely in place but cannot access any of the accounts online (existing customer, my customer log-in). I have too been told repeatedly that this is not possible. The only Nationwide account that I do not have PoA on is a Flex Direct account, apparently this is an Internet Account so PoA is not possible.

Thanks for reading, more posts to follow I am sure...

Sam.

 

[Soobee]

Just to say I have had to deal with POA for Lloyds TSB, HSBC, Nationwide, M&S Banking, NS&I and other institutions. The only one which was straightforward and easy was Nationwide but I have to admit that I was only closing it, not trying to get internet access.

In order worst first:
M&S Banking (refused to accept joint and several instruction on POA)
HSBC (mucked up so much I had to talk to the branch manager to get it sorted after numerous phone calls, again I was just trying to close it)
Lloyds TSB (continued incompetence since 2008 but they do offer internet banking to attorneys and executors)
NS&I (didn't know what they were doing or saying)
Nationwide (so easy I closed my HSBC account and moved to them)

 

[Saffie]

I have mentioned previously that I found Nationwide excellent with my Deputyship for my husband. However, my husband did have a small Nationwide ISA with them already. I changed it to an online ISA and opened a Flex account and have online banking for both. Absolutely no problem. Perhaps it's a branch problem despite you having heard to the contrary from highter authority.

my customer log-in

My husband has his own internet cusomer number - it wouldn't work using mine!

 

[FifiMo]

Like ITBookworm, I have had wonderful service from HBOS when sorting out my mother's financial affairs. My mother's accounts were based in Scotland and I live in South of England. After a personal appointment with them, everything was set up and believe me, it was no small feat as my mother thought my dead father was after her money so every other week she had opened new accounts and closed others. She had the works including ISAs. HBOS have a central office which deals with LPAs, Deputyship and Guardianship which was useful as well. When she died they helped me reconcile things for the OPG and Probate application too.

Online banking was automatic, in fact they were so efficient they sent the details out to my mother's address before the accounts had been updated to include my address.

The Clydesdale Bank however were the opposite when I discovered an account there too! They were rude and awkward and even denied the existence of the account, until I told them I had the Debit Card in my hand! I am about to go for round 2 to close the account as part of dealing with probate.

Fiona

 

[slipperysam]

I have mentioned previously that I found Nationwide excellent with my Deputyship for my husband. However, my husband did have a small Nationwide ISA with them already. I changed it to an online ISA and opened a Flex account and have online banking for both. Absolutely no problem. Perhaps it's a branch problem despite you having heard to the contrary from highter authority.

My husband has his own internet cusomer number - it wouldn't work using mine!

I have Nationwide accounts of my own, but cannot see mum & dads accounts from there. If I log in using their individual customer numbers, then naturally they are visible. I assume that this is not the way a PoA is supposed to manage the accounts.

Thanks,

Sam.

 

[ITBookworm]

Actually I would have to say the opposite

My money accounts etc. are in no way connected to those of the person I might be POA for. Yes I might pay for things with my money and then claim it back but that can still be done with two different logins. It is also technically possible that I might be POA for two or more different unconnected people (say a parent or partner and a parent-in-law). Having all the accounts show up under the same login is asking for confusion and I can imaging makes it possible and far too easy with a slip of the finger to move money from/between the wrong accounts.

I would be unhappy if everything was accessed through the same login for just that reason. In fact I am sure I remember another member on Talking Point saying that she was a professional POA and really didn't want the two sets of accounts mixed and complaining that one of the banks didn't give her any other option.

 

[Saffie]

Actually I would have to say the opposite

This is what I said. I have my own account and nline personal number and so does my husband - a different one of course. I think the post after mine said the same thing so I don't understand your post saying that you would say the opposite when, in fact you appear to be saying the same!

 

[slipperysam]

So am I "allowed" to use my parents customer numbers and passwords and move money about? If this is the case what is the point of setting up the POA on the accounts, they may have well just given me these details in the first place and told me to carry on..

Just wondering..

Thanks again.

Sam.

 

[ITBookworm]

Sorry Saffie - I seem to have confused things

I was replying to the post by slipperysam

I have Nationwide accounts of my own, but cannot see mum & dads accounts from there. If I log in using their individual customer numbers, then naturally they are visible. I assume that this is not the way a PoA is supposed to manage the accounts.

If I read his post correctly he said that he had separate logins and thought that this was wrong (the highlighting in the quote is mine).

 

[Y Ddraig]

HSBC for me!

I am a Court of Protection deputy for my BIL. His finances were in a hell of a mess when I took over (first informally and then formally with the COP). As a consequence of a lot of debt, I was turned down for deputy accounts by Barclays (who wanted to meet with my BIL, despite my explaining he lacked capacity) to discuss the account Then First Direct did the same (shame, as they do my account and their service is second to none.) Nationwide were the same too

In the end I went to HSBC and they were great. They set up me up with a receivers/business account that allows me a debit card and online banking for his account. It has turned out to be really simple and straightforward and the staff in branch were fantastically supportive.

Hope that helps!

H

 

[ITBookworm]

So am I "allowed" to use my parents customer numbers and passwords and move money about? If this is the case what is the point of setting up the POA on the accounts, they may have well just given me these details in the first place and told me to carry on..

The thing with the registering of the POA with the bank is that is makes it legal according to their rule book. If you read the endless small print in the "terms and conditions" that the bank gives you when you open an account they explicitly say the account holder should not hand over those details to anyone. They could accuse you of theft or freeze the entire account if they realised so with POA you have legitimate access which they have to grant you.

Not 100% sure about the "allowed" bit of using your parents numbers if the bank swears you are not supposed to have internet access (on-line access seems to vary from bank to bank!) Technically they should be able to lock out the account holder (in case they are still able use the access but could do unwise things like hand over the lot to some dodgy salesman) and give you a new set of login details which they can identify is you using the account.

Most banks certainly manage that with cheque books and cards etc but it all seems to get horribly convoluted and variable when internet access gets raised.

 

[slipperysam]

The thing with the registering of the POA with the bank is that is makes it legal according to their rule book. If you read the endless small print in the "terms and conditions" that the bank gives you when you open an account they explicitly say the account holder should not hand over those details to anyone. They could accuse you of theft or freeze the entire account if they realised so with POA you have legitimate access which they have to grant you.

Not 100% sure about the "allowed" bit of using your parents numbers if the bank swears you are not supposed to have internet access (on-line access seems to vary from bank to bank!) Technically they should be able to lock out the account holder (in case they are still able use the access but could do unwise things like hand over the lot to some dodgy salesman) and give you a new set of login details which they can identify is you using the account.

Most banks certainly manage that with cheque books and cards etc but it all seems to get horribly convoluted and variable when internet access gets raised.

Many thanks for the clarification ITBookworm, I am completely new to this so any advice is gratefully received. I think I will stick to going into the branch if I can, sounds safer than logging in online using their details. If only it was as straightforward as it is with Santander.

Sam.

 

[Flossie50]

Number of attorneys allowed access

My father still has mental capacity but has an LPA for Property and Finances for myself and my two brothers. We need to set up a facility where at least two of us, and preferably three, can access the online bank account to help him with his affairs. The bank will only allow one attorney to have a card and online access (my dad is still operating the account, using card, writing cheques etc. so two users are allowed in total). Is this unusual? Changing banks would be a real pain.

 

[nitram]

Giving multiple cards should not be a problem, many banks issue multiple cards to joint account holders quite often with different PIN numbers.

Asking the bank to allow internet access using different sets of usernames and passwords is a different matter.

How would the bank know which attorney was actually accessing the account?

If anything went wrong they would blame the attorney who shared the details with another attorney, if the attorneys cannot be trusted to work together the whole system breaks down.