Hi just looking for more advice. My Dad who is 80 cares for my Mum vascular dementia, she still has lucid moments but Dad does everything for them both with my help, he has carers in for two half hour visits a week to help mum shower. He used to be adamant that he wasnt going to put her in a care home but is now struggling to cope and is often in tears saying he cant do it anymore, its the constant wanting to go home even though she is home and asking him who he is and what he is doing there that really gets to him. He also has his own health problems, struggles with mobility. He now wants to put Mum in a permanent care home, hes already had her in emergency respite a couple of weeks ago but two days after she came back he is on his knees again. I phoned sw yesterday and asked for this to happen and he says there is not much chance of it as they dont feel she is bad enough and Dad only has the two mornings a week help, they would want to increase help before considering permanent care for her. I dont understand this do the 3 days a week that I help him not count? Extra care worker help is not going to change what he is up against, she is sundowning from 3pm till they go to bed at 10pm then she is up getting dressed at 1am and it all starts again even though she is on temazepam. sw said if they were self funding it wouldnt be a problem, but there is not enough money for everyone to be put into carehome. I feel helpless as I can see my Dad struggling with this and yesterday he said he wanted to die! as he has no life. The only thing I can see that I can do is change places with him but then I would lose my marriage, oh is very understanding but would not put up with that. and anyway the last time I stayed with her overnight while dad was in hospital, she nearly went for me cos she didnt know who I was, so I really dont want to put myself in that position, but I worry that as she doesnt always know dad she may get violent with him, not happened so far. I did say all this to sw but didnt cut any ice. He is going to assess Mum and Dad on Thursday, but said not to hold out much hope.sorry this is such a long post.
not sure what to do now
- Thread starter angecmc
- Start date
Your Dad and you need help and should be getting it from SS. I don't understand why the sw is not being more helpful. Respite care would be helpful at this time and I don't see why they have to get more Home care before this can happen as dementia can suddenly get worse - my Dad deteriorated very quickly over a 3 month period. My parents are in Scotland so may be different but we always got good support from ss. You probably need to play down to ss what you're doing for them to make the case that your dad can't be expected to cope on his own. It would be helpful if your Mum and Dad showed him how bad things are when he comes to assess and to stress the problems at night and the possibility of your Dad being in danger and his mobility problems. - mine had an annoying habit of being suddenly better at this time. I really feel for you and your Dad and hope things get better soon.
Last edited:
Hi Ange
I think this is disgraceful. One option you have is to phone SS and say you have just been to visit and your father is at a crisis point, can no longer cope and you are taking him home with you immediately to care for him until he is better, so your mother will have to be taken into a care home right now because there is no one else to care for her. Naturally, this is a huge step to take but it might be the kick up the rear that they need. They have a duty of care to her.
Do let us know how you resolve this.
JJ
I think this is disgraceful. One option you have is to phone SS and say you have just been to visit and your father is at a crisis point, can no longer cope and you are taking him home with you immediately to care for him until he is better, so your mother will have to be taken into a care home right now because there is no one else to care for her. Naturally, this is a huge step to take but it might be the kick up the rear that they need. They have a duty of care to her.
Do let us know how you resolve this.
JJ
thankyou Krissie, it is really difficult isnt it? Even when I asked about regular respite care, Dads GP suggested every 6 weeks, SW said they wouldnt be able to fund that it would have to be more than 6 weeks apart, the thing is Dad is so tired of it all that even though Mum was only in respite care one week ago, it doesnt feel as though it has helped. SW said he has to consider what my Mum wants too and of course she will never agree to go into a care home as she doesnt see she has a problem in her mind she does everything at home, its very sad but since the dementia she has turned intoa very selfish person. Dad has done this for 7 years now, unfortunately he only allowed me to get official diagnosis 8 months ago. I have told Dad that he must be totally honest with how this is affecting him and must tell them his fears as she is verbally aggressive at times and this could turn violent,but Im not sure if he will do this its that pride thing in their generation.I am going to ask Dads GP to write letter of support for my Dad as he did say to my Dad did he think respite every 6 weeks would be enough, got the impression GP felt Dad had gone as far as he could with this situation. I will fight Dads corner for him as far as I can
It beggars belief doesn't it? Would SS employ an 80-year old care worker to do night duty with an aggressive client 7 days a week? Can the GP give him some ammunition with a report on the state of his own health? Is he going to stay 'brave' in front of the SW or could he be persuaded to be shaky and tearful, clutching an angina spray or inhaler and asking you to get him a glass of water because he's having 'one of my turns'? I sometimes think you have to over-act to get anywhere with some people in authority.
Try and make sure that the upcoming assessment is scheduled for 4pm when your mum has already started to sundown. Ask if a SW can call in the evening to see how things are at 9pm, or 1am. I don't see how they can do a realistic assessment just by talking.
I would suggest, if things don't go well at the assessment, that you tell the SW that your dad is coming to your house for a week's respite because he is in danger of permanent collapse. Therefore they will have to take mum back into emergency care because there will be no-one to look after her - you are going to focus on dad's health and will not be looking after your mum at all during that week. We often say that people cannot be forced to be carers, but effectively they can if they live in the same house. Perhaps the only way to get them to take action is to temporarily change that dynamic so that your dad is not in the same house.
Try and make sure that the upcoming assessment is scheduled for 4pm when your mum has already started to sundown. Ask if a SW can call in the evening to see how things are at 9pm, or 1am. I don't see how they can do a realistic assessment just by talking.
I would suggest, if things don't go well at the assessment, that you tell the SW that your dad is coming to your house for a week's respite because he is in danger of permanent collapse. Therefore they will have to take mum back into emergency care because there will be no-one to look after her - you are going to focus on dad's health and will not be looking after your mum at all during that week. We often say that people cannot be forced to be carers, but effectively they can if they live in the same house. Perhaps the only way to get them to take action is to temporarily change that dynamic so that your dad is not in the same house.
thanks hopeful, strangely enough I did say that to my husband last night, that perhaps I should just take Dad home with me and leave them to get on with it, trouble is dont know if I have the courage to leave Mum on her own and Dad would probably never agree to it. Im sure SS know this and thats why they get away with not providing the help requested. I fear this will kill Dad, but then they would have to take Mum into care cos theres no way I am going to step into Dads shoes if that happens
Hi Katrine, some good points, thanks, the SW said he would prefer to speak to Dad on his own and for me to stay away for appointment, not sure if I am going to do that or not, my sister thinks Dad might open up more if I am not there, but im not sure
I believe it is important that your dad has the opportunity to be one-to-one with appointments. If he cannot deal with it that will be noted. But if he is never alone with doctors etc (without family) there will be concerns that his views do not get a chance to be expressed.
Ha! She would say that wouldn't she? Easier for her to keep telling your dad that he has to manage, rather than having a younger more savvy daughter challenging her. What a flippin' cheek! Dad is going to open up emotionally to a SW and somehow having you there will inhibit him? I can imagine some families where that might be so, but really it's just a smokescreen for her wanting to maintain the upper hand.
To be fair, I recall that when my OH was assessed as the primary carer for his mum, the assessor didn't want a whole family team present. However, in our case OH is only the nominated 'primary carer' because he is his mum's attorney under POA. The actual caring is largely done by other family members. Therefore I was allowed to be present at the assessment.
I would suggest you take the approach that they can only get an accurate picture of the family care your mum currently receives if you are involved in the assessment, since your dad cannot describe what you do as well. This should make sense to the SW in terms of there being times when you are 'on duty' and your dad is 'off duty' and e.g. catching up on his sleep.
P.S. I take your point Butter, but my cynical view is that it is not so much that the SW feels dad needs his views to be expressed, rather suppressed. He has already told his daughter that he can't cope any more. And when people are in that state they can't always stand up to authority because they are so stressed and emotional. He is also a vulnerable person and may require an advocate for his views. If not his daughter, then who?
To be fair, I recall that when my OH was assessed as the primary carer for his mum, the assessor didn't want a whole family team present. However, in our case OH is only the nominated 'primary carer' because he is his mum's attorney under POA. The actual caring is largely done by other family members. Therefore I was allowed to be present at the assessment.
I would suggest you take the approach that they can only get an accurate picture of the family care your mum currently receives if you are involved in the assessment, since your dad cannot describe what you do as well. This should make sense to the SW in terms of there being times when you are 'on duty' and your dad is 'off duty' and e.g. catching up on his sleep.
P.S. I take your point Butter, but my cynical view is that it is not so much that the SW feels dad needs his views to be expressed, rather suppressed. He has already told his daughter that he can't cope any more. And when people are in that state they can't always stand up to authority because they are so stressed and emotional. He is also a vulnerable person and may require an advocate for his views. If not his daughter, then who?
Last edited:
My point is not what the social worker feels. My point is that there needs to be evidence that the main carer has had one-to-one with doctors, support agencies etc. Otherwise there are new problems for the support agencies. And more work.
It would be a good idea to talk to their GP - he may be able to sway things - also when my Dad was being verbally aggressive and not sleeping his GP gave him sleeping pills which helped a bit. Can you be there when they're being assessed? I found that if I wasn't there they told ss that everything was hunky dory! They need to know that your Dad is at the end of his tether and that he also is elderly and no longer able to be sole carer to your Mum. GOOD LUCK!
Don't know if your dad and mum have the money or not but if you go on the Saga website it has a good page on the money side of things. The amount of savings is £23,500 per person each maximum and £14,500 minimum. If you can find out which homes are council and which are private you can then find out if a private one will take people who are part funded by the council. Your dad does not have to sell a home to pay for your mum's care.
Take control away from the Social worker!!!! you and your dad have a say in what happens to your mum. Please do not let your dad talk to a social worker on his own because he might be to scared to contradict what they are saying and it is always better to have to pairs of ears. If the SS want to speak to him alone say you are there to take notes!!!!! so that you can discuss it all as a family afterwards. AND do take notes!!!!
Take control away from the Social worker!!!! you and your dad have a say in what happens to your mum. Please do not let your dad talk to a social worker on his own because he might be to scared to contradict what they are saying and it is always better to have to pairs of ears. If the SS want to speak to him alone say you are there to take notes!!!!! so that you can discuss it all as a family afterwards. AND do take notes!!!!
The original post just beggars belief in our so called 'caring society'. my heart goes out to you but you have to be strong for your dad. It is really true the carers die of overwork looking after the cared for.So gird up those loins and do not accept the we tried but rubbish etc. Insist if caring at home is what your dad wants to do is the full 4 half hours a day and really I'm not sure that is right at his age anyway.
I had enough and pulled back and it was only then the inevitable happened and now my mum is in an excellent care home looks years younger and actually enjoys her days. It is not a failure to say you can't cope but a brave statement of the reality of the carer these days. I wish you well and in particular say that at 40 to 60 it was hard to cope, at 80 it is miraculous he is able to even with help. He should be enjoying his twilight years supported and helped not used as a nurse, chef, cleaner, you know what I mean by a society using the term carer to save money. Your parents love for each other should not mean his is abused as he has compassion.
I had enough and pulled back and it was only then the inevitable happened and now my mum is in an excellent care home looks years younger and actually enjoys her days. It is not a failure to say you can't cope but a brave statement of the reality of the carer these days. I wish you well and in particular say that at 40 to 60 it was hard to cope, at 80 it is miraculous he is able to even with help. He should be enjoying his twilight years supported and helped not used as a nurse, chef, cleaner, you know what I mean by a society using the term carer to save money. Your parents love for each other should not mean his is abused as he has compassion.
Hi ange i know exactly what you are going through as we had the same problem when my mum simply could not cope anymore caring for my Dad.When i contacted the SW she really went out her way to say that my Dad would have to stay at home with my Mum.
I then contacted my Dad's G.P. and when i explained things to him then the right decision was made and more importantly the SW could not overrule the Doctor's opinion.
Hopefully you have an understanding Doctor who will give you the support you need.
I then contacted my Dad's G.P. and when i explained things to him then the right decision was made and more importantly the SW could not overrule the Doctor's opinion.
Hopefully you have an understanding Doctor who will give you the support you need.
Hi thanks to you all for your replies and support it really helps. Just to update, the interview date came and I got a call from sw saying sorry but he was stuck on an urgent case and would call my Dad the next morning. I had spoken to my Dad that morning and he was very tearful and saying that he didnt want to give up on Mum been together 54 years so I understand how difficult it is for him. So I said I would support him whatever he wanted to do but told him how concerned I was for him, he insists he is ok, so I suggested that we ask for carers to come in everyday and any extra help they can give. I will of course monitor situation and step in if I feel he needs more persuasion. Spoke to SW before he called Dad this morning and said about increasing carers, which he has agreed to organise and he has suggested that we put in for respite care for 3 weeks time and then again in 8 weeks time , SW now seems to see things from my point of view and agrees we are nearly at time for permanent care, but says Dad needs a bit of time to get used to someone else caring for Mum hence the way Dad keeps changing his mind about putting her in carehome. I said to SW that I feel sure this will take Dad before it takes Mum which is why I am so concerned. Anyway, we have agreed to try this increase in help for now but I feel a bit better knowing SW attitude has changed. I will contact Dads GP if I have to in the future as I feel that is a good idea. Many thanks once again.
Ange
Ange
