A Beginner’s Look into…CHC (Continuing Health Care)

Chemmy

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Nov 7, 2011
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You will see in my earlier post which areas may come into the priority category ie the shaded areas,

I have my husband's completed checklist in front of me and there is a Priority category for all these areas:-

Cognition
Psychological Needs
Communication
Mobility
Nutrition
Continence
Skin
Other significant needs (?)
Altered States of Consciousness, Continence,Communication and Psychological Needs, also count if they are in in the Severe category.,The others only count in the Priority category.

That doesn't tie in with the DST information, does it?

Winda's form has four main groups which clearly influence the decision:
Altered States of Consciousness,
Continence,
Communication
Psychological Needs

whereas the DoH's DST form has a different four:

Behaviour
Breathing
Drug therapies etc
Altered States of Consciousness

Anyone care to shed a light on why that should be? Sorry if I'm being pedantic but one thing I'd like this thread to achieve is to try and sort out the discrepancies between what we read on official websites and real life scenarios.
 

Chemmy

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Nov 7, 2011
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Yorkshire
Looking at my husband's DST both Continence and communication can score Severe and Priority. This is where the government website is misleading.

We keep cross=posting, Winda :)

You're right, because on the DoH website, continence and communication can only score a maximum High. :confused::confused:
 

hopeful56

Registered User
Jun 17, 2009
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Midlands
Looking at my husband's DST both Continence and communication can score Severe and Priority. This is where the government website is misleading.

Hi Winda

Those areas cannot be scored as priority or severe. The highest they can score is High. Take a look at the document on the DoH website. Just google "decision support tool department of health" and you should find a link to a PDF dh_103329. Then scroll through the document and you will come to the form that is completed by the multidisciplinary team. I cannot post the link here as I am a newish member. I will try to post an other message if I have enough postings after this one to be allowed to post links.

Can you describe what document it is you have that has scored severe or priority for those areas? I think you have been misled, or someone is using their own version of the form!

JJ
 

JPG1

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Jul 16, 2008
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Anyone care to shed a light on why that should be?

Please compare the following:

Page 6 of the DST doc. which details 'unpredictability' and 'complexity'

Page 39 which details 'Assessed Levels of Need'

So this is where the ambiguity is coming in - anything less than the clear cut 1 x Priority/2 x Severe score is open to interpretation by the panel as to whether or not it is a primary health need.

In reality, people have achieved a score of 2 x Priority, plus 4 x Severe but have still been refused CHC, so it is not clear cut. Hence, the continuing healthcare postcode lottery.

The DST is not a decision-making tool - it is compiled after collation of all the MDT assessment evidence, and is used to 'support' the final decision. The MDT makes a recommendation as to whether or not someone is eligible for CHC - the PCT should only overturn that recommendation if there are exceptional reasons for doing so, and those reasons 'should' be communicated in writing to the applicant.

There is no requirement for any PCT to use a 'panel', but the PCT 'may' use a panel if it wishes to do so.
 

hopeful56

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Jun 17, 2009
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Shaded areas on DST

Hi Winda

I think I may have realised where the confusion has arisen. The shaded areas you mention on the completed form indicates that that score is NOT available for that domain. It is not an indication that those are the areas that have to be scored for the person to qualify for CHC.

JJ
 

JPG1

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Jul 16, 2008
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Hi JJ,

I didn't find the DoH website very helpful at the time of my husband's assessment as it did not include a full version of the DST.
Once all the areas have been looked at and put into categories they are all entered onto one chart showing all areas and categories. It is only at this stage that it is clear which areas are priorities. These boxes are shaded. Only if someone is placed in the shaded area is the person deemed to be priority. (I was told this by the nursing assessor as I was present).

You will see in my earlier post which areas may come into the priority category ie the shaded areas,

Winda, is it possible that your nursing assessor actually meant to say that those shaded areas on the 'assessed levels of need' chart are the areas where a priority cannot be given?
 

JPG1

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Jul 16, 2008
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Snap! Sorry, hopeful56, we were both posting the same thing at the same time. ;)
 

winda

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Oct 17, 2011
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Nottinghamshire
Winda, is it possible that your nursing assessor actually meant to say that those shaded areas on the 'assessed levels of need' chart are the areas where a priority cannot be given?

Hi JJ and JPG1 ,

The nursing assessor told me that in order to qualify a person needed to be placed in the shaded areas. Could it be that he was lying? This never occurred to me.
 

JPG1

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Jul 16, 2008
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Hi JJ and JPG1 ,

The nursing assessor told me that in order to qualify a person needed to be placed in the shaded areas. Could it be that he was lying? This never occurred to me.

Not necessarily lying, although that is a possibility if he was trying to put you off the right-track.

The alternative is that he had not been properly trained, so could be described as incompetent.

Was he the PCT-nominated CHC assessor?

Apologies to everyone, if this thread has now become even more confusing about the CHC process.
 

winda

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Oct 17, 2011
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Nottinghamshire
What you are saying definitely makes sense.

I'm sorry if I've thrown everyone off-track and very grateful to you Chemmy that I have had this clarified.

This makes it much simpler than I thought.
 

Chemmy

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Nov 7, 2011
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Yorkshire
Summary

Apologies to everyone, if this thread has now become even more confusing about the CHC process.

I think it's important for this to be thrashed out in simple language so that more of us understand the process .

So, just to summarise (which is important), what we're saying now is that the DoH version of the DST is correct. The easy-to-read chart which shows the categories and potential scores is on p6 and the interpretation of results is on p9

Either this format or a simpler DoH checklist can be used in the pre-assessment stage.
 
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Chemmy

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Nov 7, 2011
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Yorkshire
In reality, people have achieved a score of 2 x Priority, plus 4 x Severe but have still been refused CHC, so it is not clear cut.

Interesting....did the assessors explain why it was refused, because that's the nitty-gritty detail I'm sure we'd all like to understand?
 

Carolynlott

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Jan 1, 2007
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Newcastle upon Tyne
I have a copy of my Mum’s assessment in front of me, and JPG1 is right - it is not possible to be classified in the shaded areas in the Assessed Levels of Need summary table because those categories don’t exist for certain needs (e.g. there is no “severe” box to tick on the Altered States of Consciousness page, therefore it is shaded out on the summary table). My Mum qualified with 2 severe, 4 high, 3 medium, 2 no needs – I suspect that despite attempts by the decision tool to come up with an objective numerical measure, there is still a lot of subjectivity (opinion if you like) in the actual decision. Unpredictability in behaviour seems to play a big part.
C
 

Chemmy

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Nov 7, 2011
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Yorkshire
What you are saying definitely makes sense.

I'm sorry if I've thrown everyone off-track and very grateful to you Chemmy that I have had this clarified.

This makes it much simpler than I thought.

So, Winda, are you able to tell us the scores your husband got in each category when he was refused? Please don't feel you have to if it's too personal, but it would be useful to look at some real results.
 

Chemmy

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Nov 7, 2011
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Yorkshire
My Mum qualified with 2 severe, 4 high, 3 medium, 2 no needs –.... Unpredictability in behaviour seems to play a big part.
C

Thanks for that, Caroline. Now we can put some meat on the bones...

That would tie in with the guidelines, which says if you have 2 severe , you qualify.

Can I ask what the severe and high categories were in your mum's case? And can you describe how she was in relation to each of them - I think that's what we really want to know. What does "Severe" and "High" mean in relation to everyday life.

For instance, does double incontinence count as a High? (top score for that category)
 

Saffie

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Mar 26, 2011
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Near Southampton
This is all very interesting and should be vital for me as I am re-applying for CHC funding, both retrospective and forward, but, call me cynical if you will but -

In reality, people have achieved a score of 2 x Priority, plus 4 x Severe but have still been refused CHC, so it is not clear cut. Hence, the continuing healthcare postcode lottery.
- as JPG has said there, it is still a postcode lottery as so much depends on any person's opinion as to the gravity of a condition. The lady from the AS support group told me that my county is not a great one to be asking for CHC funding whilst others have been mentioned on here as being more generous. One just hopes that on the day appointed the gods have very large and comfortable laps for it to land in!
 
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JPG1

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Jul 16, 2008
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Please don't talk of a pre-assessment stage, without saying Checklist and/or full assessment. Even the Checklist is an assessment of a kind. Sometimes there is no Checklist assessment; sometimes there is. Sometimes there is no MDT assessment either.

1. The first stage of the 'average' CHC process is for someone to make an application/request for CHC to be considered to be appropriate bearing in mind that they know the health of their relative best of all.

Perhaps, we could call it 'ask for CHC to be considered'. If someone is in hospital, and likely to be despatched to a care home, that 'consideration' should happen before social services are involved (if they are to be involved at all), and before discharge. (There are circumstances where a full pre-discharge assessment may not be appropriate, and it could be deemed that assessment after discharge might be more appropriate, for a whole variety of different reasons.)

Everyone has the right to ask for CHC to be considered, at any time, any place.

2. You could either put your request to the 'chief' nurse in hospital, or direct to the PCT Continuing Healthcare Lead Coordinator. In fact, you can ask the PCT to 'consider' your request for CHC at any point, no matter where your relative is. You can do that yourself.

3. The first stage of the whole 'consideration' process may be via the Checklist. (Unless it would be more appropriate for the Fast-Track Pathway to be considered.)

4. The Checklist is there to decide whether someone should continue to a full assessment, via a Multi-Disciplinary Team assessment. If the Checklist-person says that you aren't eligible for a full assessment, you should ask the PCT (not the person who completed the Checklist, but the PCT) to reconsider that decision.

5. After Checklist has been gone through (if appropriate), the next stage is for a full assessment via the MDT, which results in the Decision Support Tool (DST) being completed. NB. The DST is created at the end of the full assessment, and is more-or-less a gathering together of all the evidence. But in itself it's not an assessment.

6. If the PCT decides that there will be a Panel involved, the relative/family/applicant can be present at the full discussion, and may also be present during the 'decision-making process' when the recommendation is made.

The relative/family/applicant must be involved at each and every stage, and must ask for a copy of the paperwork involved, as the application progresses along its path. Otherwise, s/he will have no way of understanding decisions that have been made.

I've tried to use simple and easy words, so as to make it easy to understand.