Today consultant from "memory clinic" came to assess MIL, diid memory test. I think she scored 27 or 28/30. He said she didint have dementia or Alzheimers but had "age related shortterm memory loss". He will recheck test in a few months to see if there's any change. Is this normal? She is really struggling with day to day things because of lack of memory, even today had forgotten he was coming and it was only beacuse I called round early morning that she was out of bed in time for the appointment.
What is dementia and what isn't? Confused!
- Thread starter legolover
- Start date
Had the same thing with my FIL. It is annoying, as many people with dementia seem to find inner reserves when they are being assessed and do really well in the tests, etc.
As I understand it, the only way to get a diagnosis is with a CT or MRI scan.
My mum scored 29 on her first test and 6 months later scored 28. However we did present the consultant with a diary of behaviour and how her memory was affecting her daily life. Because we were concerned about a further deterioration he ordered a CT scan and Alzheimers was diagnosed and she was then prescribed Aricept.
If she is being tested again in a few months I wouldnt worry about it now, but write down how her memory is affecting her life or indeed putting her at risk.
It is all very hard to come to terms with.
Sue
As I understand it, the only way to get a diagnosis is with a CT or MRI scan.
My mum scored 29 on her first test and 6 months later scored 28. However we did present the consultant with a diary of behaviour and how her memory was affecting her daily life. Because we were concerned about a further deterioration he ordered a CT scan and Alzheimers was diagnosed and she was then prescribed Aricept.
If she is being tested again in a few months I wouldnt worry about it now, but write down how her memory is affecting her life or indeed putting her at risk.
It is all very hard to come to terms with.
Sue
Hello Legolover, I am sorry to read that you feel the consultant did not get a true picture of your mum.
I do agree with Sue, it is a good idea to keep a diary of any concerns that you have. We kept a written list which we printed and sent to the consultant, with a copy to our GP. It can't do any harm.
With very best wishes to you xx
I do agree with Sue, it is a good idea to keep a diary of any concerns that you have. We kept a written list which we printed and sent to the consultant, with a copy to our GP. It can't do any harm.
With very best wishes to you xx
I was confused by what the consultant said, which was that "a few" older people get Alzheimers or dementia, and far more common is "age related memory loss" which he said only affected short term memory but no other aspects of thought. Is this just a matter of terminology? He said that "about 10%" of people with memory loss go on to develop dementia" and that's why he wants to monitor her memory test scores to see if there's a change.
As you suggest I'll go on keeping a diary. I did send him a written list of problems we had noticed before the appointment but he just said everything on it could be explained in terms of short term memory loss and she should " try to keep her brain active"
As you suggest I'll go on keeping a diary. I did send him a written list of problems we had noticed before the appointment but he just said everything on it could be explained in terms of short term memory loss and she should " try to keep her brain active"
Hello , Am not sure if this will help or make you more 
or not ! but before Dad was Dignosed in 2009 he had very Strange behavoiur in 2008 & when walking to the shop etc he had some type of "Accident on the Street / or road " ( live very near Parents & saw him later in the day & saw injuries ) Not many months after that he was reffered to M Clinic via G P who had done M M S E Test
Tho of course every body is different & think Dad was "leading up to Dementia " in 2008 if you see what i mean
Sorry if this does not help & please ignore if it does not help
Love Grove x
or not ! but before Dad was Dignosed in 2009 he had very Strange behavoiur in 2008 & when walking to the shop etc he had some type of "Accident on the Street / or road " ( live very near Parents & saw him later in the day & saw injuries ) Not many months after that he was reffered to M Clinic via G P who had done M M S E Test Tho of course every body is different & think Dad was "leading up to Dementia " in 2008 if you see what i mean
Sorry if this does not help & please ignore if it does not help
Love Grove x
Is it just me or does that sound like saving the NHS the cost of the drugs?
We were told that MIL was the same. Not dementia, not Alzheimers even though she didn't know her family, had never heard of me who had looked after her and she invented grandchildren and great grandchildren. She had no idea what year, where she was, couldn't feed herself was incontinent etc. We were told it was just old age. Interestingly her death certificate did list dementia as one of the causes.
I am glad that the consultant is going to keep an eye on your MIL, keep a diary and if things progress too quickly I would ring the consultants secretary before the 6 months is up if necessary.
I wondered the same. There are many people in their 80s and 90s still as sharp as ever. If there is a significant change in short term memory then logically there is something going on in the brain.
Have you noticed any other things, such as unable to follow simple requests, not bothering with things, loss of balance, decline in personal hygiene or cleaning in general, not eating properly, etc. I am 58 and I know my memory ain't what it used to be, but my memory loss is totally different to the way my mum presented.
Sue
A big problem in diagnosing dementia is that people have individual starting points in the first place - this reflects their educational background, general intelligence and so forth. So some people will always "score" lower in any circumstance. Also, the score will fluctuate from day to day (if someone is feeling unwell or tired, for example) - or even if they happen to dislike the person giving the test or not!
It is also correct that many people have a decline in their abilities that accompanies old age.
In the very beginning it can be difficult to separate what might be the start of dementia and simple declines due to age.
However, in dementia the decline will relentlessly continue and will reach levels that are abnormal for any age.
The test you speak of is really more useful in establishing a bench test mark against which future tests are measured. In this way it is possible to measure the extent and rate of decline over time.
Usually, any "score" of 25+ would be regarded as "normal" within the general population. Some attemp will be made to adjust it for mitigating factors, for example, dyslexia, educational lack, visual difficulties, speech/hearing impairments and so on.
For these reasons the test score is only part of the diagnostic process. Of more importance is how the patient presents and even more their history as stated by people who know them well. Dementia cases are nearly always initially reported by families who recognise abnormal behavior in the person.
A diagnosis of dementia will be fairly firm if there is evidence that there is a decline, that it is continuing and that it is more rapid and/or severe than might be expected of a consequenc eof old age. The more rapid or severe the decline the stronger the liklihood of dementia.
Different diseases progress in different ways. Alzheimer's for example is usually characterised by a relatively slow and steady decline; vascular dementia by periods of stability spaced between rapid and more severe declines.
Thus a score of 27 only indicates that the person is in the "average normal" range and that reports of decline may be simply those associated with age in some people. A test in say six months time is more siginificant. A lower score combined with more reports of worsening symptoms would be a strong indicator of a problem but even then it is not definitive.
One of the great problems of dementia is that there is no definitive diagnostic test, physical or otherwise.
This is correct. A mild decline in ability, and espescially short term memory, is a normal consequence of old age for many people but not everyone. The reasons are not clearly understood.
It is for this reason that the early signs of what might be dementia are often dismissed as being "old age" because in many people such signs are just old age.
It is also why at one time dementia was called senile dementia - literally meaning, "of old age" because it was thought to be a normal part of the aging process that just happened to be more severe in some people than in others. In the same way that, for example, some people's eyesight fades earlier and more severely whilst others appear to be almost unscathed.
Dementia is now recognised as a set of specific diseases that are not normal.
My mum was first diagnosed in Jan, with a scan and a memory test of 26/30. In July the memory test had dropped to 17/30.
She has been ill for years, but its taken us that long to pin her down and get tests done.
My concern is the rate of decline. She is 84 and in reasonable physical condition, but we see an almost weekly decline. She is now 'living' mainly in the 1960's and we have to drag her back to present times constantly. She has recently started to hallucinate again (which was under control with quetiapine) and we are trying to get the dose increased.
To consultants, doctors and extended family she presents very well, but cant keep it up for more than a couple of hrs.
She has been ill for years, but its taken us that long to pin her down and get tests done.
My concern is the rate of decline. She is 84 and in reasonable physical condition, but we see an almost weekly decline. She is now 'living' mainly in the 1960's and we have to drag her back to present times constantly. She has recently started to hallucinate again (which was under control with quetiapine) and we are trying to get the dose increased.
To consultants, doctors and extended family she presents very well, but cant keep it up for more than a couple of hrs.
This
http://www.stvincents.ie/dynamic/File/Addenbrookes_A_SVUH_MedEl_tool.pdf
http://www.stvincents.ie/dynamic/File/Addenbrookes_guide.pdf
is a more stringent test than the MMSE
It give a score out of 100 together with an MMSE score out of 30.
http://www.stvincents.ie/dynamic/File/Addenbrookes_A_SVUH_MedEl_tool.pdf
http://www.stvincents.ie/dynamic/File/Addenbrookes_guide.pdf
is a more stringent test than the MMSE
It give a score out of 100 together with an MMSE score out of 30.
To be honest
after 20 years working in health field this sounds typical of how medical people who don't know how to talk to people approach things!
My mother was already being treated by the mental health team for anxiety, when I raised the possibility of dementia after she responded to something I said to her by throwing a tantrum like a two year old. I suggested this to the CPN who fortunately agreed with me (though she does know I'm 'ex-job') and a CT scan revealed marked brain atrophy. She still scores pretty high on the cognitive tests though.
As other people have said - keep your own records of observation and present these when your mother is being reviewed. Good luck & best wishes
after 20 years working in health field this sounds typical of how medical people who don't know how to talk to people approach things!
My mother was already being treated by the mental health team for anxiety, when I raised the possibility of dementia after she responded to something I said to her by throwing a tantrum like a two year old. I suggested this to the CPN who fortunately agreed with me (though she does know I'm 'ex-job') and a CT scan revealed marked brain atrophy. She still scores pretty high on the cognitive tests though.
As other people have said - keep your own records of observation and present these when your mother is being reviewed. Good luck & best wishes
