Grandchildren Visits?

helen.reasbeck

Registered User
Jul 23, 2010
1
0
Doncaster
Hi, my mother has recently entered a nursing home after spending several weeks in hospital and has now been granted NHS continuing care much to the relief of my father.
Since my daughter last saw her she has gone down hill dramitically and has lost lots of weight and is very confused to what she was a few months ago.

My eldest who is 16 was very close to her nannan and I am not sure as to wether it would be appropriate to take her to see my mum (don't want to upset my daughter) Has anyone any advice on this ? I also have an 11 year old who doesn't understand whats happening to her and I am not sure how best to deal with this.

Thanks
Helen
 

PostTenebrasLux

Registered User
Mar 16, 2010
768
0
London & Oxford
Dear Helen,

From my experience, I would definitely include your daughters to visit your mother.
For one, there is a bonding of the two sisters and you in your dealing with the situation of your mother - they will be there to understand and share your pain and you will acknowledge theirs. That is an important part of adolescence, continuing a bond, and for once not related to boys or permission to stay out.
Yes, the girls will hurt, but life is like this. However, what is vital is to explain the illness and illustrate the visible signs: head tilted on one side, the vacant look, considerable weight loss, hair not as usual, sitting in slippers gazing without seeing... The sounds they will encounter.

A good tip is to sit in the parking lot outside the home for a bit to watch anyone coming in and going out, watching their expressions. Looking at the building, thus reducing stage fright. A little time in the lobby to check the reception out without being seen, take in the smells, sounds and atmosphere. Beforehand you will have explained about your mother's room, the dining room and communal lounge... explain about the other residents.

There is never a "right time" to deal with life. No doubt the girls will react with tears, slamming doors and possibly not wanting to be at home. Normal. Give them space and above all, respect and time. They are resilient and will digest their feelings. Learning about pain is hard but it will make them into compassionate young women who understand more about caring for fellow humans than "only" spending time sleeping late and listening to blaring music. They will understand you when you cry, are upset or angry. Your mother may be, but their grandmother too. They are old enough not to have life sugar coated and will likely come across other people who know someone with Alzheimer's. Just think that the girls can respond "yeah, I know what you mean, my nan..." and no doubt you'll be proud of them.
Go together - one is never sufficiently prepared - but you'll be stronger and "rebond" no doubt.
Bless you and stay strong - another test of your mothering skills and you are doing such a great job juggling with chemistry and hormones.
Good luck to you and do let us know Helen how you get on.
Martina
 

Onlyme

Registered User
Apr 5, 2010
4,992
0
UK
I have the opposite view. At about 12-14 yrs I was taken to see my beloved Great Aunt after she became ill. What I saw was not my aunt, it was an old woman who didn't know me from Adam and I couldn't see my aunt in her and would have passed her in the street. I saw her just before she died and I still have an image in my head that I wished I hadn't.

I have said I will never do the same to my kids.
 

LinzyE

Registered User
Mar 13, 2008
12
0
I, and both my brothers have been to see my grandma, especailly she is now at the stage she is and initially we were all rather upset and not too willing to visit. But since we have visited we have been able to say the things we need to say and ask questions that have come up either by asking parents, uncles, aunts or nurses and hense we have learnt alot about when has happened and what will happen.

Although when i now look at my grandma, its not her, but deep down it always will be and im glad ive been able to tell her i love her and chat with my grandad and family member around her about happy memories.

If a simialr thing happens to my parents and i have children then i would be happy for them to visit but been aware of there feelings and issues which may follow.

Linzy
 

MGB

Registered User
Jun 26, 2008
73
0
Shrewsbury
My 7 year old was very close to granny. While she was still at home he still sent to see her. When she went into residential EMI he asked not to go any more. Some of it was about granny but the others in the home upset him too. Now she is moving to nursing care he does not even want to see the new care home. Ive allways taken in what he says and do not push him to see his gran.
 

MJW

Registered User
Sep 24, 2009
154
0
East Sussex
This depends very much on the maturity of your daughters. If they are young for their ages and have led sheltered lives, I think it might be too traumatic and unnerving for them to see adults in a vulnerable state when, after all, they are still of an age to rely on adults for their own wellbeing. On the other hand, some girls of this age will be quite worldly and matter-of-fact about it. You know your daughters and I don't, but looking back at what I was like at those ages, I think 16 is probably OK, 11 seems too young. In any case, they do need to be warned what to expect well in advance of the visit.
 

Notwaving

Registered User
Mar 5, 2010
173
0
Somerset
Do they want to see her ? We as adults know that when we visit our Mum and she is nasty to us . We accept it's the dementia, I think it depends on how your Mum is.If she just looks very ill, tell the girls. Children are frightened of shouting and crying.
I would say ,go if you want to, but don't feel guilty if you want to remember her as she was.
My grandson Fred (4) loves to see Mum, the ladies in the dinning room give him icecream so we take him at lunch time.He chats away and is a big hit with everyone. Mum likes all the fuss this creates.
Charlie (7) not so keen. He is more aware what is going on. So i usually take Fred.
 

Canadian Joanne

Registered User
Apr 8, 2005
17,710
0
70
Toronto, Canada
I think asking your daughters if they want to go is the first thing. If one or both do want to visit, explain about the disease before you go.

I visited my grandfather when he was in long term care and it wasn't explained to me what was wrong. They called it "hardening of the arteries of the brain" back then so it had to be some form of dementia. He wasn't nasty, he simply couldn't speak and it broke my heart, as I was only 14 at the time. In retrospect, I'm glad I went.
 

PostTenebrasLux

Registered User
Mar 16, 2010
768
0
London & Oxford
Reply to Norman's question

Dear Helen,

Apologies for the "hijack" on your thread and for this second response.

I may be "overreacting" to Norman's message, but as he addressed his post only to me, "what is your experience", I feel I am being challenged rather than you being offered his reply to your thread. It is not my intention to offend, just responding to Norman as he asked.

My experience? As a grandchild of 8 I went to visit my grandfather in his nursing home and at 10 my widowed grandmother both at her home and in the nursing home. I was living abroad but had a close relationship with my grandparents and saw them regularly several times a year. This was in 1964 and 1967.
My parents had sat down with me to explain, using photographs of my grandfather (in his healthy days) to explain how AD deteriorates an individual and how he had physically and mentally changed. They talked about the place his was in. They spoke about what he could and could not do for himself, what equipment was needed to nurse him (wheelchair, hoist, hospital bed, commode etc) and described his personal effects in his room etc. Having told me all this, a few days later (time to digest the information), they showed me photographs they had taken of their visit with my grandfather, mother sitting next to him. He looked a whole lot thinner, his eyes more set as his face shape changed. A couple of days later, we went to visit him. He clearly did not remember me, could not speak well, needed spoon feeding and wiping as he dribbled. He shouted and screamed - I knew about that. It was not nice at all, but I held my father's hand. I could see my mother was upset - she was crying, silent tears running down her cheeks. She just sat and held her father's hand, stroking his forehead with the other and whispering comforting words to him. When we said goodbye to my grandfather, outside the room my mother turned to me and through her tears hugged me and said "thank you for coming to see my father. Even if he did not recognise you, it means a lot to me". I was 8 years old. My special grandfather died a few months later.
When my grandmother was "unwell" and still living in her own home, my mother explained that her mind was sick but her body was still well enough to live at home a while longer but that she needed everyone to help in looking after her. By then I could "compare" my grandmother's illness against my experience of my grandfather's. I had a lot of elderly relatives (my grandparents were born in 1878 and 1881) and became quite used to visitors who included "galoshes", extra spectacles, walking sticks and wheelchairs with blankets. I was given the role to make sure the blankets did not get stuck in the wheels, run and fetch whatever was forgotten etc and to turn a blind eye when shouting started.
When my grandfather died, my mother spoke of the good days of the strong man, talked about his life and kept alive the man that he had been. Of course we touched on the illness but it did not take over the fond memories. I learned an awful lot about patience, other people's pain (and my own).
By the age of 12 I had been to 6 funerals of people I loved, including my father who died whilst I cuddled in his arms. It was unusual, up to a point, but then again, that was life...

There was a woman neighbour who was a "raving lunatic" inasmuch as she was constantly bursting with anger and fired on a short fuse. She had no dementia, just a really foul temper. I could "avoid" getting in her way, because she wasn't family...

My grandmother? More of my grandfather's situation more prolonged, more intense, more painful. I was older, I saw more and understood more. I went to friends' houses where there were senile relatives, rocking endlessly in their chair, drooling, repeating the same words, over and over and over again. They didn't know me, but I remembered them when they used to peel an apple for me or fetch my friends from school...

Now I am 53, my children are 21, 23 and 25 and my granddaughter 8 months. They have all been included in my cousin's AD journey, 11 years of awareness and interaction for them. Sometimes, several months have elapsed between visits and the deterioration has been impressive. Even the baby is part of the situation: she cried at first when my cousin screamed but after being comforted and reassured, she has got used to the screaming.

I have learned a lot from my childhood and am still maturing...

How are we ever going to get rid of the stigma of Alzheimer’s unless we educate ourselves? Knowledge is power and “charity” starts at home. Of course, it is not for everyone, but this is “my experience” with my grandparents.

Martina
 

CaPattinson

Registered User
May 19, 2010
11,730
0
West Yorks
visists

Hello, Helen, I agree with only me in that No definitely not would I let youngsters visit. I am basing it on me as a grown up seeing my mum in the late stages - an image I will never ever forget. Kids should be protected in my view and allowed to remember sufferers as they were before the ravages of this disease.

I will just say that my grown up daughters remind me sometimes how I have always tried to protect them from harm in any way shape or form - wrapped in cotton wool would be a true description. So my view is coming from the direction of protect children at all costs - not always the best way to go. But I still believe I would explain she was too poorly for visitors if they want to go and not take them.

Whatever you decide helen, I truly hope all goes well. x Chris
 

Vonny

Registered User
Feb 3, 2009
4,584
0
Telford
Hi Helen,

I think you can only go by your daughter's wishes, especially in the case of your 16 year old. Considering at 16 people are allowed to marry and have children (not saying I necessarily agree with this!) go to work and so forth, I think you'd be doing your elder daughter a disservice if you didn't at least find out her wishes.

Your 11 year old is obviously a different kettle of fish. If your elder wants to go, the younger probably will as well, regardless of whether she should. Only you know your children enough to know what is best for them.

My son was 15 when my mum went rapidly downhill and he visited her sometimes, always giving her a hug much as he disliked it. He knew how much his gran had loved him and they'd been very close when he was younger. He appreciated being able to "pay back" her love which made my mum very happy.

Incidentally, how lovely to see the word "nannan". That was what we always called my grandmother, and I've never heard anyone else use the term. Thank you for bringing back memories!

I hope that whatever you decide, your daughters and their nannan are happy with the decision. Good luck xx
 

sallyc

Registered User
Aug 20, 2008
1,674
0
47
suffolk
I would talk to your kids. Ask them what they think. Answer any questions they have. Be honest about what it's like and, if they do want to go, make it clear that if, at any point, they change their mind or want to leave, then that's what you'll do.
 

Jancis

Registered User
Jun 30, 2010
2,567
0
70
Hampshire
Hi Helen,
It would be great if you could take your mum outside into the garden and maybe your daughters could see her outside of the NH. This may be impossible of course, but one of the things about visiting some homes is that it can often be other people that can upset the visit more than the loved one you are visiting. On the other hand, looking on the positive side one of the other patients might make a fuss of your daughters.

My daughter was only 8 when her beloved great granny ('Big Gran') died after a long illness at home where she lived with us. She was naturally very upset but took it in her stride and wanted to kiss her goodbye.

Good luck and take care
Jancis
 
Last edited:

CraigC

Registered User
Mar 21, 2003
6,633
0
London
Hi Helen,

It does depends on your situation and only you will know what is right. Kids react very differently but my experience is that children are a lot less judgemental and a lot more caring than many adults. They deserve a lot of credit and often surprise us.

Our daughter has always been involved in dad's care and dad's life at home, in residential care and nursing home. He has had dementia since she was very young (1 year old) and she is now eleven. In my opinion it has made her more rounded and more caring being involved. She has always wanted to see her granddad and loves him. The alternative was to hide granddad away from her for the last 10 years. She was the last person that he recognised / reacted to and his face always lit up on her visits. I always give her the choice about visiting and even at this late stage, more often than not she will want to come along and see him, chat for a bit, hold his hand, cuddle and give him a hug. Tidy his room a bit or get all the pictures straight. Talk to him about her day. I really believe that he still takes comfort from her presence.

Not saying it is easy for her by any means!! But personally I'd find it hard to shut him out of her life. There are some days when she finds it difficult to visit so we always give her the choice to stay at home. But if it is more than a week or two she will ask to see dad.

There are other threads dotted around on this subject (search for 'visiting children' for example
http://forum.alzheimers.org.uk/showthread.php?t=24512&highlight=visits+children

Sorry you are having to make these these difficult choices. Hope this helps and please feel free ask any more specific questions. The timing and purpose of visits are important for children in my opinion Going for a walk for example or helping with lunch / feeding.

Kind Regards
Craig
 

RustySaddle

Registered User
Jun 30, 2010
188
0
Dorset
I agree with Craig, giving the children a job to do while you are there, they will be able to focus on the job at hand and could focus less on the other residents, i.e., painting nails, showing some school work. Prepare them well and ask if they want to go, if they do go with the flow, if you feel there is a situation brewing while your there, have a quick excuse for an exit, i.e., say it's just a quick visit, then you can play it by ear from then on. Maybe let the 16 yrs old read this thread, to get an idea of the possible things she may face. Good luck, I remember going to see my Aunt in a terrible state when I was 14, what broke the ice was my mum giving her some flowers saying they were from her garden, she was over the moon and started with the sound of music, again:eek::)
 

Margaret W

Registered User
Apr 28, 2007
3,720
0
North Derbyshire
For what its worth, I'd say ask each child what they want to do. The older one might give it a whirl, the younger one could be too scared. See how it goes.

After all, what is the point?

Margaret
 

Margaret W

Registered User
Apr 28, 2007
3,720
0
North Derbyshire
Martina, I don't think Norman meant anything more than to ask what was your experience. And a very interesting and moving experience you have given to us.

The issue of involving children must be sometimes traumatic, and we must protect them from such trauma, but on the other hand if we can introduce them to illness as being a part of life's pattern, well that is good.

I haven't tried it, so have no experience to bring to this.

Margaret
 

Divingcoco38

Registered User
May 18, 2010
6
0
Doncaster
Decided

Thankyou for all the replies to my thread, I have decided to let my eldest daughter who has just taken her GCSE's and has studied Psychology so I think she will be a little prepared as to what to expect.
I will explain to her that she might see some disturbing sights as the last time I visited my mum and elderly gentleman pulled his trousers down and peed in the corridor before I got get a carer to sort him out!
I think as she is growing into a sensible young women its only fair to show her the downside of life and that we should live our lives to the fullest. Maybe Im a little selfish? She might be upset as she was very close to her nannan but I don't want her to say later that I never let her visit her before she dies.
My apologies for the new name as I had to re register as I couldnt remember my passwords lol
Thanks to you all again for your help