Help, what a shambles!

[susanandliam]

O.K. where to start. Mums in care home, her son (he has shared and several POA with me) taking hundreds of pounds at a time to travel to visit her for himself, wife, daughters and a boyfriend with money being paid directly to himself so no transparency on what is costing what. Final straw took large amount of money (hundreds) out of mums bank account to sponsor himself on a charity event.

After I complained to the OPG he applied to the COP to request to take travel costs out going forward and retrospectively and I objected. He has also asked the OPG to be involved in this.

To cut a long story short this has now been called to a court hearing which I am expected to attend. All I wanted was for the COP to decide on the evidence provided whether he should or should not be taking this money! I certainly don't want to go to court, why should I have to go when I'm not the one taking the money and I have made my feelings clear?!

 

[jenniferpa]

Because in a situation like this it's entirely reasonable that they would wish to ask further questions and this is the standard way to do it.

I'm sorry you feel blind sided by this but I think it's normal.

 

[susanandliam]

Because in a situation like this it's entirely reasonable that they would wish to ask further questions and this is the standard way to do it.

I'm sorry you feel blind sided by this but I think it's normal.

Thank you, maybe I was being naïve I just thought that I'd give my opinion and they would make their decision. I have been to hell and back and left on the edge of a breakdown bought on by this man so I certainly can't now face going to court and being in the same room as him

 

[Beate]

I think if you want a solution you'll have to or he might win by default.

 

[susanandliam]

I think if you want a solution you'll have to or he might win by default.

I know what you're saying is right although technically if he shouldn't be taking the money then he shouldn't be taking it surely irrespective of whether I go to court or not. But as I say I doubt if I will go as I have been through hell and back over the last two years. I'm just starting to get stronger and I don't want to make myself feel bad again.

 

[jenniferpa]

Something that you need to consider, and I don't know how likely it is (whether you go or not) but it's possible that the court could decide that the lpa is unworkable due to the conflict and decide to appoint a panel deputy. If you do decide not to go, you need to prepare yourself for whatever you feel would be the worst case scenario.

Edit: I'm assuming this isn't a witness summons (if that's applicable in this court)? Because if it is, attendance isn't optional. I supposed your attendance is optional (in that if you fail to attend it doesn't open you up to any liability) but you should make absolutely sure.

 

[susanandliam]

Something that you need to consider, and I don't know how likely it is (whether you go or not) but it's possible that the court could decide that the lpa is unworkable due to the conflict and decide to appoint a panel deputy. If you do decide not to go, you need to prepare yourself for whatever you feel would be the worst case scenario.

Edit: I'm assuming this isn't a witness summons (if that's applicable in this court)? Because if it is, attendance isn't optional. I supposed your attendance is optional (in that if you fail to attend it doesn't open you up to any liability) but you should make absolutely sure.

The email I received was worded as an 'attended hearing', as I've never had any dealing with any kind of courts in my life I didn't even realise what this meant as it didn't say I had to go! It was only when I emailed to query it they said the judge has requested that we both go but if I can't go to email them (which I did earlier) and they'd pass it onto the judge.

Even thinking about going upsets me.

 

[Kevinl]

Wow, you'd have to fight to keep me away from seeing him squirm as the judge tells him the guidelines say that;
"Expenses
You can only claim expenses for things you must do to carry out your role as an attorney, for example:

• hiring a professional to do things like fill in the donor’s tax return
• travel costs
• stationery
• postage
• phone calls

You can be ordered to repay the donor’s money if you misuse it or make decisions to benefit yourself."
Keep your receipts and invoice the donor for your expenses. The money is paid by whoever’s in charge of the donor’s funds.
Let's hope they ask him to pay back all the none attorneys travel costs that should never have been paid like his wife and kids and anything else he doesn't have a receipt for, I'd be there just to see the look on his face.
These hearings are usually very informal, there's no judge in a wig and gown you just all sit round some tables and it's more like a discussion. if you're not there and he makes some claim about what happened and the judge doesn't believe him then without you the case could fall apart so you really need to be there in case that happens.
You could within the rules (above) hire a professional (in your role as an attorney) and claim that back as an allowable expense as it's in your mum's interest to have this money returned.
Personally I'd pay to be there and see justice get done, too often people in your position get fobbed off by the claim "it's a civil matter" by the police or the CoP don't want to know and they get away with it. I hope it all goes well, come back and tell us.
K

 

[DeMartin]

I was under the impression that “social “ visits were not claimable, visits to escort to medical appointments are.

I travel to the Southwest from Kent to check on mum’s home, pick up mail, sort stuff. My OH comes too, I am only claiming for my travel, OH keeps me company but doesn’t do anything towards the home care. Therefore I don’t feel his train fare is my mother’s responsibility.

If, as we plan on our next trip he repairs the peeling wall paper and decorates the hall, then his train fare is claimable.

 

[susanandliam]

Wow, you'd have to fight to keep me away from seeing him squirm as the judge tells him the guidelines say that;
"Expenses
You can only claim expenses for things you must do to carry out your role as an attorney, for example:

• hiring a professional to do things like fill in the donor’s tax return
• travel costs
• stationery
• postage
• phone calls

You can be ordered to repay the donor’s money if you misuse it or make decisions to benefit yourself."
Keep your receipts and invoice the donor for your expenses. The money is paid by whoever’s in charge of the donor’s funds.
Let's hope they ask him to pay back all the none attorneys travel costs that should never have been paid like his wife and kids and anything else he doesn't have a receipt for, I'd be there just to see the look on his face.
These hearings are usually very informal, there's no judge in a wig and gown you just all sit round some tables and it's more like a discussion. if you're not there and he makes some claim about what happened and the judge doesn't believe him then without you the case could fall apart so you really need to be there in case that happens.
You could within the rules (above) hire a professional (in your role as an attorney) and claim that back as an allowable expense as it's in your mum's interest to have this money returned.
Personally I'd pay to be there and see justice get done, too often people in your position get fobbed off by the claim "it's a civil matter" by the police or the CoP don't want to know and they get away with it. I hope it all goes well, come back and tell us.
K

Wow, you'd have to fight to keep me away from seeing him squirm as the judge tells him the guidelines say that;
"Expenses
You can only claim expenses for things you must do to carry out your role as an attorney, for example:

• hiring a professional to do things like fill in the donor’s tax return
• travel costs
• stationery
• postage
• phone calls

You can be ordered to repay the donor’s money if you misuse it or make decisions to benefit yourself."
Keep your receipts and invoice the donor for your expenses. The money is paid by whoever’s in charge of the donor’s funds.
Let's hope they ask him to pay back all the none attorneys travel costs that should never have been paid like his wife and kids and anything else he doesn't have a receipt for, I'd be there just to see the look on his face.
These hearings are usually very informal, there's no judge in a wig and gown you just all sit round some tables and it's more like a discussion. if you're not there and he makes some claim about what happened and the judge doesn't believe him then without you the case could fall apart so you really need to be there in case that happens.
You could within the rules (above) hire a professional (in your role as an attorney) and claim that back as an allowable expense as it's in your mum's interest to have this money returned.
Personally I'd pay to be there and see justice get done, too often people in your position get fobbed off by the claim "it's a civil matter" by the police or the CoP don't want to know and they get away with it. I hope it all goes well, come back and tell us.
K

Hi Kevini
Your explanation of how the court is set up makes me feel a little less intimidated.

I'm not sure he'll squirm as he was a long standing police officer who is used to court and probably will get some twisted pleasure in making it as difficult as possible for me.

I would like to think the court would stop him from paying the money directly to himself (rather than it being paid to the provider of the transport) when he keeps on taking money out of the account for his and his family's travel though I'm not convinced they will. I have emailed the cop and said I don't think for the sake of my health I can go and asked if I have to go. I will see what they come back with

 

[susanandliam]

I was under the impression that “social “ visits were not claimable, visits to escort to medical appointments are.

I travel to the Southwest from Kent to check on mum’s home, pick up mail, sort stuff. My OH comes too, I am only claiming for my travel, OH keeps me company but doesn’t do anything towards the home care. Therefore I don’t feel his train fare is my mother’s responsibility.

If, as we plan on our next trip he repairs the peeling wall paper and decorates the hall, then his train fare is claimable.

Thank you and that's what I feel is right. I don't mind him taking a reasonable amount even for himself and his wife but it's the total lack of transparency. And he has done nothing to help with mum denying she was unable to cope on her own and fighting me every step of the way. Even the mental health care team upon having to tell him she wasn't safe (as he didn't believe me) asked what planet he was on.

Myself and my husband have done everything for her clearing her flat out selling it finding her a home etc etc whilst he sits on the sidelines criticising.

 

[susanandliam]

Would someone be able to accompany you and support you? Victim Support or CAB might be able to suggest where to find a volunteer if you can't think of anyone.

Thank you for this advice I'm not even sure if I am allowed to take anyone with me if I do go as the letter had no information in it other than the time, date, place and duration! I will certainly look into this if I have to go and if my husband can't.

What upsets me with this is the way it's been handled at no point was I told it may end up in court and I've been given no advice whatsoever !

 

[Pete R]

Thank you for this advice I'm not even sure if I am allowed to take anyone with me if I do go as the letter had no information in it other than the time, date, place and duration! I will certainly look into this if I have to go and if my husband can't.

What upsets me with this is the way it's been handled at no point was I told it may end up in court and I've been given no advice whatsoever !

You really should try to go to the court if you possibly can.

Bear in mind you are not going as a defendant just as an interested party and as such will be treated with the utmost respect. The proceedings will not be adversarial and will be nothing like is seen on TV. I would also hope the judge would keep your Brother in line if he tried to treat it as the type of court he was used to in the past.

Jennifer earlier said that the final decision could be to appoint a professional to take over PoA but equally the Judge could decide to disqualify either one of you from the PoA to make it run more smoothly. Would you be happier handling things on your own?

 

[susanandliam]

It would certainly be a thousand times easier to manage the financial side on my own. I have been left to sort all the personal/healthcare matters for mum anyway, thank you

 

[tangled89]

Do it for your mum, people with dementia are taken advantage of daily, take a stand. Get all your evidence of his wrongdoings together before you go then you can be confident. I know for me it would make me feel worse in the long run if I didn't go the guilt would eat away. Best of luck and i hope you win.

 

[tangled89]

I fought the NHS for 11 years for causing my daughter's birth injury and won if you need any specific advice about what to say or what it's like just ask me I'll be happy to support you

 

[tryingmybest]

I attended 3 court hearings relating to my Mothers case. It is very important that you go. You can take someone with you but they would not be allowed in the actual room where the hearing takes place. If you would like more information on what to expect/what happens on the day and the necessary forms that should be completed in advance of the hearing ('re what you wish to happen ie take over finances yourself and evidence of any wrong doings) do pm me. All this information can be emailed to the court for the Judge to read in advance. Most of these things can be done in writing thus relieving the pressure of having to stand up and speak on the day. Most of the time each party are in small rooms and negotiate with the solicitor and very little happens in the court room itself.