New care home fees

[Patsy Petal]

My husband has severe dementia, has been self-funding for the past three years and his savings are now depleted to the level where I can ask for help from the local authority.
His care home is having major staffing problems so I've been looking at other care homes in case I need to move him but I am told either that I have to show evidence of being able to self-fund for a further two years or that I have to find ways to top up from the amount the local authority will pay - both of which are impossible.

Dementia nursing care in my area now typically costs £1300 per week, of which the NHS pay £154 for his Funded Nursing Care and the DWP pays £83 per week Attendance Allowance, which leaves me to find £1063 per week while he is fully self-funding or £650 plus half his private pension, all of his state pension, his attendance allowance and his FNC allowance if I were topping up from the maximum the local authority are willing to pay.

It seems we are trapped. I know that when I was first looking for a care home I was being asked to confirm that we could self-fund for twelve months and even that seemed dreadful. There seems to be no control over care home fees nor over their demands, even the ones which call themselves charities.

Is this common experience and has anyone found a way around it?

 

[jenniferpa]

Hello and welcome to Talking Point.

I'm sorry to be depressing, but I'm not sure that you have your calculations correct if I'm reading what you wrote correctly. When you are LA funded, the 50% of the occupational pension and his state pension (less the personal expense allowance) goes to offset the payment the LA is prepared to make. AA will stop. How the FNC is handled varies: some places do actually use it to reduce the rate, some consider it included already. So when you are working out how much you need to top-up, you have to simply consider how much the LA is prepared to pay, with maybe some wiggle room related to the FNC.

 

[love.dad.but..]

When dad started in a dementia nursing home nearly 3 years ago, as a self funder I wasn't asked about his ability to self fund long term. Sadly he died 3 months ago but on talking to the administrator at his home, she showed me a form that all potential self fundng residents have to complete now and part of that is declaring the amounts of savings. I feel it is an invasion of financial privacy but she said they, as we all know, have to operate at a percentage of self funders so they cannot accept short term self funders who then apply for lesser LA funding. Dad had FNC but the home would not deduct that from his fees which like your partner was £1300 pw.

 

[LizK]

When my husband went into a nursing home, I had to commit to having enough savings for 3 years care fees. Like the other posts, the fees are £1250/week, and I would be lying if I said I found it easy to pay. The fees are on my mind in everything I do and buy. My husband worked until he was 65; I know of a case where the husband retired at 55 and spent his savings going round the world. Now his fees are paid for him. There is no fairness in this system.
Liz

 

[carpe diem]

I can't answer your question but I do sympathise with you. My mum has just moved into a care home and I've put her house on the market to pay the £920 per week fee. I've just been told that the local authority will pay £451 per week as a differed payment, we of course have to pay back with interest and admin fees.
It seems so unfair that the local authority rate is half of the real fees. I live in Bristol and all the homes quoted around £900.
I worry what will happen when the money runs out and how we'll pay the shortfall before the house is sold and if we'll get a 12 week disregard.
On and on the worries go as if Alzheimer's isn't enough.
It's really unfair if the self funders are subsidising the local authority residents. I just don't know how people cope. I'm not suicidal but every day I think there's just no point to this life like this. The only answer is put more money into research, we need a cure. What is the point in curing all these cancers and other diseases to make us live longer and get Alzheimer's, it makes no sense.

 

[Pete R]

Is this common experience and has anyone found a way around it?

Yes it is very common and there is one way around it.

When the LA are involved they have to provide you with at least one Nursing Home in their area that can meet your husband needs and they will fully fund.

If you do not like this home then you will have to pay a top up for somewhere else.

 

[Patsy Petal]

Thank you - I'm sorry for not responding earlier but here's a further query

Thank you to everyone who responded to my post. The situation seems hopeless and the nightmare continues.
I'm wondering whether I can care for my husband at home now that he's no longer mobile, agitated and defensive. He is unable to communicate and I would need help with his care because he is also unable to make any voluntary movement so re-positioning him every two hours is necessary.
People tell me I'd be unable to cope but there's a lot of equipment available now, with special slide sheets, slings and hoists - and I already sit with him for hours each day.

I really need a proper assessment of his needs and my ability to cope with them - and an idea of how many hours of paid assistance we would need but I don't know who to contact about this.

Has anyone here taken someone from a care home to care for them at home? How did it work out?

 

[Clarkey]

Organising joint finances on going into permanent care home

Dad is now going into permanent care. We are self funding apart from his NHS nursing care contribution.

I am wondering what to do with Mum and Dads finances to protect Mum as well as pay for Dad.

So they have two joint accounts. Dad's pension is paid into one. And Mums pensions into the other one.

Should I make "the other one" just in Mums name to protect her income?

Is Mum entitled to take 50% of dads private pension into her own account for her living expenses?

Is there anyone who offers financial advise for this situation?

It is unlikely that dad will live long enough to exhaust his own savings, but I want to set things up as best we can now so that Mum is also protected to live in their jointly owned flat at the moment and should she need care at a later date too.

Is there anything else "financial" we should do at this stage.
We have PA for Dads finances.

Thanks for your insights.

 

[LadyA]

Dad is now going into permanent care. We are self funding apart from his NHS nursing care contribution.

I am wondering what to do with Mum and Dads finances to protect Mum as well as pay for Dad.

So they have two joint accounts. Dad's pension is paid into one. And Mums pensions into the other one.

Should I make "the other one" just in Mums name to protect her income?

Is Mum entitled to take 50% of dads private pension into her own account for her living expenses?

Is there anyone who offers financial advise for this situation?

It is unlikely that dad will live long enough to exhaust his own savings, but I want to set things up as best we can now so that Mum is also protected to live in their jointly owned flat at the moment and should she need care at a later date too.

Is there anything else "financial" we should do at this stage.
We have PA for Dads finances.

Thanks for your insights.

Clarkey, I don't know enough about the UK system to answer your questions, but it might be better to start your own thread about this in the "Legal & Financial" section, so more people will see it.

 

[pippop1]

Clarkey, I don't know enough about the UK system to answer your questions, but it might be better to start your own thread about this in the "Legal & Financial" section, so more people will see it.

My parents both went into a care home at the same time. They had a joint bank account only and everything was paid (pensions) into that. We had to keep the bank account topped up in order to pay the fees (over £100k per year for the two of them so it had to have lots in it)

When my Dad passed away my Mum got all the money that it was in the joint bank account towards her fees. The balance in a joint account automatically passes to the survivor of that joint account.

I suggest you split their finances. It makes things much easier and fairer.

 

[Clarkey]

Clarkey, I don't know enough about the UK system to answer your questions, but it might be better to start your own thread about this in the "Legal & Financial" section, so more people will see it.

ah thank you didnt realise was section for it. Will do.

 

[Clarkey]

My parents both went into a care home at the same time. They had a joint bank account only and everything was paid (pensions) into that. We had to keep the bank account topped up in order to pay the fees (over £100k per year for the two of them so it had to have lots in it)

When my Dad passed away my Mum got all the money that it was in the joint bank account towards her fees. The balance in a joint account automatically passes to the survivor of that joint account.

I suggest you split their finances. It makes things much easier and fairer.

Thank you. It seems to me that is right and makes things easier down the line for any assessment.

 

[Roseleigh]

Its a very frightening situation for those of us who are spouses of a dementia sufferer as one wonders what will be left for us if we need care eventually, as we will have no partner to help us.

Its so wrong that the cost of care should fall on victims of neurological disease. Cancer is the lesser evil.