Need Help - Psychosis/Delusions in Mid/Late FTD but Pending Diagnosis So No Support?

elysian

Registered User
Jan 25, 2017
2
0
Hello everyone, I hope someone can advise me.

My Mum is 82. For 4-5 years or so, she has gradually had increasingly severe memory and speech/language problems. However, until recently she was always able to put on a good act with the GP, and my Dad (in complete denial) wouldn't bring up the problems to the GP. So the diagnosis process was left very late and only began late in 2016.

Just before Christmas, following several scans etc (which had to be re-arranged several times, as she refused to attend them), the GP told my Dad that the preliminary diagnosis was frontotemporal dementia. She has an appointment with a consultant next week.

But. My Dad took her up to Scotland for Christmas/New Year to visit my brother, who they hardly ever see. While she was there, she had a complete breakdown, presumably triggered by the travelling and strange surroundings. She didn't know who anyone was, including my Dad, thought people were trying to kill her, and so on. It was so bad that my Dad (85) didn't think it was safe for him to drive back with her (it takes them three days, since, due to his age, they take it in small chunks and we're nearly 500 miles away).

While up in Scotland, they took her to A&E, and she was prescribed quetiapine as an anti-psychotic, and also diazepam to calm her down. Then bad weather set in, and it was another 10 days before they finally made it home.

Since getting home (where she's lived for more than 20 years), the delusions have only become worse. She now thinks she's being held here against her will, she claims she's not married and her family are waiting for her elsewhere. She gets very aggressive about it, and is constantly asking for the police to be called. We live here with her and my Dad, but even us as three competent adults, we're struggling to calm her. We've tried reasoning, showing her photos etc, which not surprisingly doesn't work. We've tried sympathising and changing the subject, we've tried soothing and distracting her, but nothing works. She will not be distracted from the focus of wanting to get "home" or trying to get us to contact her "family".

She did see her own GP yesterday morning, and put on a good front for him appearing almost normal. He is however obviously aware of the Scottish breakdown and the NHS contact she had while up there. I have rung the GP surgery several times in the last 48 hours, on occasion in floods of tears, begging for help - a referral to elderly mental health, or a community psychiatric nurse, or social services, or something, anything, anyone, who can advise us, help us, teach us how we're supposed to deal with this. I was effectively told to go away by the GP, who is refusing to refer her anywhere until the diagnosis is confirmed. He won't arrange anything, not even a social services care assessment, until then. Trouble is that although the initial consultant appointment is next week, the GP has already told my Dad that the consultant will want to arrange further MRI scans etc before confirming the diagnosis, and this this is likely to take a few months all told.

So we're effectively being abandoned for a few months, until the diagnosis is official. She has prescriptions for quetiapine and diazepam, but most of the time she refuses to take them anyway, thinking we're trying to poison her or something. We truly cannot cope and are at our wit's end.

Can anyone teach me/advise me how to cope with these delusions when distraction doesn't work? We can't "go along" with them, or we'll end up having to call the police for her or allow her to call the police. She's not interested in anything, won't eat and is in a constant state of distress, from the time she wakes up until the time she eventually sleeps. On the days when she will take the quetiapine, she does at least sleep for 8 hours or so, but otherwise she wanders most of the night too in distress.

Surely it can't be right that we're not allowed any support in the meantime? How are people supposed to cope if diagnosis has been made late, and symptoms are this bad in the meantime?

Should we just take her to A&E in the hope that this gets her onto the radar better? We've offered to do that, but of course she won't get in the car. We'd have to lie and say we were going to take her home.

I'm sorry for such a long post, but I truly don't know where to turn now that the GP has ruled out any kind of community help or support. Thank you so much for any advice you can offer.

[Sorry, forgot to add that she DID have a mild UTI while in Scotland, but apparently she does not currently have an infection of any kind, according to her GP, so it's not that exacerbating the situation]
 
Last edited:

Beate

Registered User
May 21, 2014
12,179
0
London
You don't need a GP referral or a diagnosis for Social Services. Contact them yourself and say you need urgent help. Tell them they have duty of care for a vulnerable adult at risk. Tell them you need both a needs assessment and a carers assessment. You're entitled to one by law.

If they don't react promptly enough, get the Alzheimer's Society or the local Carers Centre involved as your advocate.

Also, don't hesitate to phone police or ambulance at her next meltdown. They are trained to help and also have the power to put pressure on Social Services.

And while you're at it, change GPs. He is clearly useless.
 

elysian

Registered User
Jan 25, 2017
2
0
Thank you Beate. I didn't realise that about social services, we were led to believe by the GP that it needed a referral. And yes, he is clearly as helpful as a chocolate teapot.

I also didn't realise that the police were used to/OK with this kind of thing, I thought they'd consider it wasting police time or something. I guess we will have to let her ring them then, and see what happens. I will contact social services in the meantime. Thank you for your help.
 

Shedrech

Registered User
Dec 15, 2012
12,649
0
UK
hello elysian
my goodness what a horrible time your family are having
welcome to TP - at least you have found this community, so you'll be able to sound out your worries and get info and advice from members here
Beate is spot on with what she writes, she knows her stuff
when you contact your Local Authority Adult Services use these phrases - your mum is a 'vulnerable adult' who, in view of her current behaviour, is 'at risk' and the LA have a 'duty of care' - do not be afraid to tell them exactly how it is for your mum, your dad and the family - better that they are made aware that you are not coping than you play things down and they don't get a full and proper picture - you're asking for an assessment of your mum's care needs and for a carer's assessment for your dad - that's not to say things will snap into place, but you are signalling that there are major concerns
keep a daily record of your mum's behaviours and your concerns, and write up what happened in Scotland along with what made you seek a diagnosis in the first place - yes, the GP will have been sent medical records, but you need your own evidence to show the impact of what is happening - it sounds as though you are trying to cope and that your mum needs much more support - hopefully the consultant will be more sensible; tell them everything and take along your own account of what has been happening, maybe even send a copy to them beforehand so they have an idea of what you are dealing with
is there another GP at the surgery? may be worth making your next appointment with someone else - personally I'd find a way to get a urine sample tested, it is very possible that a UTI is still present and is causing havoc, or another infection may be at play
this link to compassionate communication may or may not help, it gives some pointers - does sound as though you've been trying these ideas eg distraction - definitely don't explain/argue as that just builds up resistance and negative emotions
https://forum.alzheimers.org.uk/showthread.php?30801-Compassionate-Communication-with-the-Memory-Impaired
if possible, leave your mum to calm down, as long as she is somewhere safe; don't ask anything of her; keep lights low and try her favourite soothing music, calming scents ..
if you need to, call out paramedics and the police - they are well versed in these situations and if they are concerned can make their own referrals
keep posting
best wishes to all of you
 

bdmid

Registered User
Dec 4, 2013
36
0
73
Bristol
I so know how you feel, I was in the very same situation as you

Hello everyone, I hope someone can advise me.

My Mum is 82. For 4-5 years or so, she has gradually had increasingly severe memory and speech/language problems. However, until recently she was always able to put on a good act with the GP, and my Dad (in complete denial) wouldn't bring up the problems to the GP. So the diagnosis process was left very late and only began late in 2016.

Just before Christmas, following several scans etc (which had to be re-arranged several times, as she refused to attend them), the GP told my Dad that the preliminary diagnosis was frontotemporal dementia. She has an appointment with a consultant next week.

But. My Dad took her up to Scotland for Christmas/New Year to visit my brother, who they hardly ever see. While she was there, she had a complete breakdown, presumably triggered by the travelling and strange surroundings. She didn't know who anyone was, including my Dad, thought people were trying to kill her, and so on. It was so bad that my Dad (85) didn't think it was safe for him to drive back with her (it takes them three days, since, due to his age, they take it in small chunks and we're nearly 500 miles away).

While up in Scotland, they took her to A&E, and she was prescribed quetiapine as an anti-psychotic, and also diazepam to calm her down. Then bad weather set in, and it was another 10 days before they finally made it home.

Since getting home (where she's lived for more than 20 years), the delusions have only become worse. She now thinks she's being held here against her will, she claims she's not married and her family are waiting for her elsewhere. She gets very aggressive about it, and is constantly asking for the police to be called. We live here with her and my Dad, but even us as three competent adults, we're struggling to calm her. We've tried reasoning, showing her photos etc, which not surprisingly doesn't work. We've tried sympathising and changing the subject, we've tried soothing and distracting her, but nothing works. She will not be distracted from the focus of wanting to get "home" or trying to get us to contact her "family".

She did see her own GP yesterday morning, and put on a good front for him appearing almost normal. He is however obviously aware of the Scottish breakdown and the NHS contact she had while up there. I have rung the GP surgery several times in the last 48 hours, on occasion in floods of tears, begging for help - a referral to elderly mental health, or a community psychiatric nurse, or social services, or something, anything, anyone, who can advise us, help us, teach us how we're supposed to deal with this. I was effectively told to go away by the GP, who is refusing to refer her anywhere until the diagnosis is confirmed. He won't arrange anything, not even a social services care assessment, until then. Trouble is that although the initial consultant appointment is next week, the GP has already told my Dad that the consultant will want to arrange further MRI scans etc before confirming the diagnosis, and this this is likely to take a few months all told.

So we're effectively being abandoned for a few months, until the diagnosis is official. She has prescriptions for quetiapine and diazepam, but most of the time she refuses to take them anyway, thinking we're trying to poison her or something. We truly cannot cope and are at our wit's end.

Can anyone teach me/advise me how to cope with these delusions when distraction doesn't work? We can't "go along" with them, or we'll end up having to call the police for her or allow her to call the police. She's not interested in anything, won't eat and is in a constant state of distress, from the time she wakes up until the time she eventually sleeps. On the days when she will take the quetiapine, she does at least sleep for 8 hours or so, but otherwise she wanders most of the night too in distress.

Surely it can't be right that we're not allowed any support in the meantime? How are people supposed to cope if diagnosis has been made late, and symptoms are this bad in the meantime?

Should we just take her to A&E in the hope that this gets her onto the radar better? We've offered to do that, but of course she won't get in the car. We'd have to lie and say we were going to take her home.

I'm sorry for such a long post, but I truly don't know where to turn now that the GP has ruled out any kind of community help or support. Thank you so much for any advice you can offer.

[Sorry, forgot to add that she DID have a mild UTI while in Scotland, but apparently she does not currently have an infection of any kind, according to her GP, so it's not that exacerbating the situation]


Hello

Just over a Year ago I was in the very same situation, fighting to get heard. Like you I was on my knees so In sheer desperation I called 999 for an ambulance. They were amazing, the first response paramedic immediately took control of the situation, he called her GP to say he was'taking capacity' from mum, which effectively was sectioning her. Another crew arrived and took care of me whilst it all happened, I was just as broken as mum. It was traumatic, and ill never forget it, and eternally feel guilty, but it had to happen there was no other options available to me. My message to you is DO call the services, if you they get her into hospital its the first hurdle, which should then get social services involved for her wellbeing and safety and of course yours too. The outcome for me was a nursing home was found for her. It wasn't, and is still not easy but the extra care I could not give is there for her now. I really feel for you, but maybe it's time you took that next step for both your sakes. I also must add, I had such support from TP it helped enormously, and I still need it for advice even now. Sending big hugs to you.
 

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