Social worker - legal position

[bumblefeet]

Just wanted to update this thread, and say a huge thank you to all who replied and offered support.
We had our BI meeting yesterday, and as a result of that, mum is moving to residential care once the paperwork is complete.
Various options were considered, including extra care, but, due to her needs, residential was the chosen option, and we also have the home that we feel meets her needs.

The social worker turned out to be actually quite nice, and she involved us in all of the discussion.

So, thank you, for all of your advice and support.

 

[Kjn]

Good to hear that bumblefeet x

 

[canary]

Common sense prevailed. That is just such good news

 

[Meppershall]

Wonderful news Bumble, I'm so glad you have got the best result for your Mum and you x

 

[bumblefeet]

Thanks all!
I think we struck lucky, because the SW wanted to send her to extra care, but, as a family we would have had to reduce our visits, it's the other side of town. As she has a right to visits and support from her family, the extra care was rejected.
Also, she needs regular prompts to drink/use the bathroom etc., so extra care was rejected on that basis also.

I can't tell you what a relief it is. I've actually done a productive days' work today, the first since she fell, almost 3 months ago.

We still need to move her in etc., but we are all feeling mightily relieved.

And, we went to visit her after the meeting, and she totally justified the decision. She was quite merrily bonkers.

 

[Soobee]

I am delighted to read that the right decision has been made. It sounds like such a stressful situation. If you can take it a bit easy now, please do, as this sort of thing can lower your immunity for a bit.

 

[joggyb]

Good to hear you got the right result. And best of luck with getting your mum into the chosen home and settled in.

 

[HillyBilly]

A big sigh of relief from me on your behalf.

 

[Sterling]

In my experience we had to try a home trial for my mum - Social Services insisted! Having spent an hour on the phone with someone high up in SS they told me that if the DOLS people visited mum and she said she wanted to go she has a legal right to challenge the decision even though she lacks capacity. The judge could ask if she had tried at home and if she hadn't decide that she should.
So long story short - we did the home trial - it failed but SS now agree with me that she should be in a home and now have enough evidence to support the decision. Mum has challenged the decision to be placed in a home and it's now going to court.

 

[bumblefeet]

In my experience we had to try a home trial for my mum - Social Services insisted! Having spent an hour on the phone with someone high up in SS they told me that if the DOLS people visited mum and she said she wanted to go she has a legal right to challenge the decision even though she lacks capacity. The judge could ask if she had tried at home and if she hadn't decide that she should.
So long story short - we did the home trial - it failed but SS now agree with me that she should be in a home and now have enough evidence to support the decision. Mum has challenged the decision to be placed in a home and it's now going to court.

Wow, very different result there.
I don't understand, if your mum lacks capacity, why haven't you had a best interests meeting, to decide on her behalf?
It's a well know fact that PWD ask to go home, but they don't mean their home, it could be anywhere really, it's a concept, not a physical place.

 

[irismary]

Just reading through this thread as my mom's social worker is doing all she can to keep mom in her extra care flat even though she sundowns from 4pm onwards, rings me to fetch her as she thinks she isn't at home, wanders the flat looking for me in my pram etc. The home have said they cannot ensure her safety as its not a secure unit - people cannot get in at night without a key but you can always get out just by approaching the doors and its on a main road. The SW wants to up the amount of time the carers are in for but that doesn't make her safe. I got annoyed and upset as this is the third social worker in 6 months and I know we have to go through hoops but why the same hoops every time they reallocate work. She would be LA funded so we have no choice. Not sure that I will be attending any more meetings with them as its too stressful - my husband also has Alzheimer's and they keep saying we need to help you don't we. Well it would help if I didn't have to worry about my mom. Think I will leave it to my brother he stays more calm than me.

 

[irismary]

SW also said she would pop in and have a chat with mom about where she wants to live. During the day she is ok and wants to stay where she is, at night she wants someone with her. Should she really see mom without one of us there?

 

[Sterling]

Wow, very different result there.
I don't understand, if your mum lacks capacity, why haven't you had a best interests meeting, to decide on her behalf?
It's a well know fact that PWD ask to go home, but they don't mean their home, it could be anywhere really, it's a concept, not a physical place.

The law is changing to protect patients being put in homes by relatives who don't need to be. There are so many cases going through to court now. Your freedom is so valued that even if you lack capacity you have a right to challenge the decision.
SS had to prove that the least restrictive option had been trialled and failed. They now agree with me and have enough evidence to support this. We have had 5 best interest meetings.

 

[bumblefeet]

Five meetings, that must be so draining, and to have to trial a home visit too. It seems that we were lucky, but, we had 5 health care professionals in our meeting, and this helped, as they all gave so much evidence to the SW, to determine that mum needed 24 hour care. The SW wanted to send her to extra care, but, it was on the other side of town, thus reducing our visits. This was then rejected because mum wouldn't have had the emotional support of her family. As it was deemed that she was unsafe to live on her own, residential care was the last option, but, the most appropriate.

I think we had a lucky escape. Mum is now settled in a lovely place, just 5 miles away, where we can visit to our hearts content.

I hope it goes well for you.
xx

 

[Sterling]

It's been a very long journey- more than 15 months now.
Btw everyone in the first BIM agreed with me that mum would be best placed in a nursing home... it's was only social services, mum's IMCA and mum that disagreed... we had the majority 6 to 3 - it didn't matter. They kept saying that it could end up in court and needed to show that we had tried....

 

[Munchies]

Whoops it never occurred to me that we needed permission. Dad had a social worker assigned after a fall in September last year took weeks for them to arrange a meeting while we did all the care for him including moving him into sheltered accommodation. Then when they saw him he said he didn't like living there (only been there a couple of weeks) and wanted to go home. SW said yes absolutely he could go home with support 3 times a day for meals!

However house was not fit damp, dirty, Windows about to fall out etc coupled with not able to look after himself properly. He can dress and feed himself but wants company so would invite strangers round or go out on his mobility scooter talking to anyone he met. This got concerning very quickly as he gave his card to a random person to get money out of the cash machine to buy stolen meat that they were selling!!

SW went away and said she would sort out a care package then we never heard from her. He then had further seizures and a fall and stroke was queried but decided not.

We got dad to agree to go to daycare at a local care home with a good reputation and a dementia unit if needed at a later date and he loved it very rapidly moved from 1 day to 2 to 3 then wanted full time. We explained to him that he could go full time but that needed money and the only way to get that money was to sell his house. It took lots of discussion but he could see the practicalities of it being safe looked after, being fed and most importantly company. And he acknowledged on his good days that he couldn't really live alone and anyway he hated being alone.


We were lucky that a room became available only a couple of weeks later and so he signed the papers to sell his house and moved in just before Xmas self funding.

Then last week the social worker contacted us just to see how dad was doing and had we managed to move him home with a care package? She seemed very shocked that he was now in residential care. She sort of implied that we had sold his house and moved him in against his will. She asked to pop out and visit him to see how he was and if he was happy. She seemed happy for me to be there also but I didn't realise until afterwards that it was a Best Interests meeting.

She asked him if he was happy in new home and of course he said no (he is still a little bit in the settling in stage). She asked how he came to be living there instead of at home and dad with his sarcastic sense of humour said we sold his house and he had nowhere else to go!!

Luckily she seemed able to ask other questions and get the information that she wanted that yes despite the "rules" he likes living there, talking to people and the food is good.

I never even considered that we had to involve them or ask permission as we were not asking them to fund anything and his house sale is enough to fund him for a few years and to be honest he might not have that long.

 

[Slugsta]

Thanks for the update bumblefeet, I am so glad that common sense prevailed in the end!

I started reading this thread when you first posted it, at that time it was of academic interest only. Mum was managing reasonably well in her supported housing flat and a care package of visits + day centre.

The package was increased recently as Mum was not coping too well. Then she had 5 falls over the course of a weekend and was taken into A+E on the grounds that she was unsafe to be at home. She had been wandering during the night, her bed hadn't been slept in for ages.No cause found for the falls but SW determined to return her to the same situation that had been considered unsafe 7 days previously!

Mum was asked 'where do you want to go when you leave hospital?' but not given any idea what the options might be. She first said she wanted to live with me , then said 'home' (of course!). Mind you, she also agreed to respite care on several occasions. SW said respite not suitable, would be sent home (even though we pointed out that the Housing Association who own her flat do not want her back!).

I pointed out that I don't believe Mum has the capacity to make that decision and was told that she would be asked what she wanted and then returned home as that was the 'least restrictive' option.

Then Mum stopped walking altogether - she currently needs 2 people and a hoist to move her. Physios agree that respite, for assessment of long-term needs, is the best option - but says that we still have to convince the SW as Mum is not self-funding and SS have total control as they hold the purse strings

The SW has not been near us since this happened a week ago! I don't know whether she is even aware of the change or is going to rock up expecting to send Mum home. I have made 2 things very clear - firstly, I will not co-operate with any plans to send Mum home as I do not believe it is safe for her to do so. Secondly, I go away on 21st Feb for 2 weeks and will not be around to make any arrangements or attend meetings.

Watch this space . . .