What is standard policy with a bank when you register an LPA

[cuddyduck]

My Mum has early stages of dementia. She manages to get cash out ok by going to the counter. But she will sometimes lose her cards or cheque book this has led to cheques bouncing and complicated situations.

She was being pursued by a debt collecting agency for her ground rent and she did not understand that her
cheques had bounced because she had cancelled them. She asked for my advice so I went to the debt collecting agency to figure out what had happened. I advised my Mum to go to the bank and settle up (that was the cheapest way to resolve it). When she did not do this and was about to be taken to court I silently registered LPA on my Mum's bank account and managed to do an internet banking transfer of the
outstanding amount. Unfortunately the debt collecting agency then wrote and told her the debt had been paid and she phoned them up and was told it was me that paid it for her. She then went to the bank and asked for the LPA to be unregistered from her account. In the meantime she lost her keys and called 5 locksmiths. Two turned up; one changed the lock and the other wanted travel expenses for being called out. She could not find her cheque book so they asked for my number as next of kin. When I tried to settle the bills using internet banking I found out that I no longer had internet banking access.

I discussed with the bank and they say I can register the LPA again but either I completely have to take over her account OR she will be able to unregister the LPA.

Is there not some sort of half way house. Where I can register LPA and she can still draw cash each week. She is never reckless with cash, lives within her means but she cant handle the more complicated payment of one of bills now.

What is a banks responsibility in these situations. Is there a code of conduct or policies that I can quote at the bank. When I speak with different people at the bank I get the feeling I am being told something different each time.

Unfortunately she lives an hours drive away so I cant take full control of her account. She needs to able to get cash out for as long as she can manage; but I will need to be able to step in sometimes.

 

[try again]

Set up a bank account for bills and a little one for her to play with?

 

[cuddyduck]

Set up a bank account for bills and a little one for her to play with?

It might come to that. We have to work around her at every twist and turn. She is in denial about her memory issues and very suspicious of people trying to get her help etc. What might have to happen is that I create a new bank account in her name that she can not touch; move her pensions and bills onto that and pay the balance into her account. All a bit complicated.

 

[try again]

Easier to give her a new account and block the old one , would she notice?

 

[Lynmax]

It might come to that. We have to work around her at every twist and turn. She is in denial about her memory issues and very suspicious of people trying to get her help etc. What might have to happen is that I create a new bank account in her name that she can not touch; move her pensions and bills onto that and pay the balance into her account. All a bit complicated.

We have had to do something similar for Mum after she gave a salesman a cheque for £500 deposit for some unnecessary work on her windows - the company went into receivership two years ago and are no longer trading! Luckily we were able to stop the next cheque for £1500 but she lost the deposit as the cheque was cashed less than an hour after she wrote it! We have now had an interview with her bank and registered the LPA. All three attorney have debit cards, PIN numbers and Internet access and mum still had her own card and cheque book.

After discussion with the bank, we have moved all but £1000 into her savings account and have gone paperless so that she will no longer get bank statements so will not know the changes. Her pensions will be paid into her account so she can get cash out and write cheques but each month we will transfer out any excessive funds. That way, she can only be scammed of a small amount as she does not have an overdraft arrangement and her debit card is only linked to this one account.

Hopefully she will forget that she has not had a statement and not go to the bank to ask for one! She tends to moan to us first so we can try to deflect her. However, the bank have got a note on her account saying that she has Alzeimers and if she appears confused at the counter or keeps going in to get cash or statement, they will contact me. She will be fine with the changes if she knows that the money is still in her savings account and we can always up get her a statements of that account if necessary. However, we are convinced that it won't be long before we need to do all financial transactions for her so we are in a position now to step up as soon as needed. We now have peace of mind that we have done all we can to protect her money while still giving her some independence. She has too much capacity to be fobbed off with us just giving her a bit of cash to keep in her purse, she enjoys using her card too much!

 

[try again]

And of course redirect all the mail and if she queries said they have all gonevpaperless

 

[Sirena]

I started using my LPA for similar reasons, because my mother was forgetting how to transfer money between her accounts, so there was not enough money to cover her rent/bills. She also got into debt with a mobile phone company.

When I registered the LPA the bank (Halifax) asked me if I'd like her to still have access and I said yes, because she needed to get cash out at the counter. But I would have cancelled access if it became necessary. I am not aware of there being a 'halfway house', either she has access or doesn't, and if she's going to cancel the LPA you need to prevent her having access. In terms of her getting cash out, I guess opening another account for her to use for cash is the solution. You can set it up as an LPA account with you both having access, (if she cancels the LPA on the second account it won't matter as much). You can ask the bank to send all correspondence only to you.

I know you want her to continue to have some independence, but her capacity is going to diminish and you will need to step in more and more. To begin with I was reluctant to take over my mothers finances, it felt all wrong, but actually it was the only thing to do.

 

[Slugsta]

My Mum's bank (Nationwide) revoked her card when they issued mine, they said it had to be all or nothing,

 

[cuddyduck]

I am not aware of there being a 'halfway house', either she has access or doesn't, and if she's going to cancel the LPA you need to prevent her having access. In terms of her getting cash out, I guess opening another account for her to use for cash is the solution. You can set it up as an LPA account with you both having access.

I phoned the Alzheimer's Society helpline today to see if there was any advice. They agreed that there is a world of difference between going to a counter and getting cash out and getting a letter and returning a completed direct debit form in response to a request and putting it in the post. For now Mum can get cash out without issue. I don't know if it would be possible for me to setup another account without her ID papers etc for the bank. It would not be something she would agree to. So I will have to make enquiries with the bank. As she has no relatives nearby and we are 1 hour away she must continue to have access to her cash otherwise we will have to drop cash off each weekend.

 

[Sirena]

I hope you find the bank helpful in finding a way which will work for you both. She needs to be able to get cash but you also need access. Let us know what they say.

 

[cuddyduck]

After that I sent her £50 cash per week in the post

Did you live a distance away from your Aunt ? I'm not sure sending money in the post would work. She will deny I sent her a letter unless I am lucky enough to call her on the day it arrives and she has not lost it.

and ordered food deliveries online - but she sent them away.

exactly the sort of thing my Mum would do.

 

[try again]

My mother has a building society account with a pass book. It started originally as the building society had a branch locally. Money is transferred into it as needed. She can't write cheques now or use a card and the passbook is easy for her. It also seems to be a safer method for her.

 

[Lynmax]

We have just registered mums LPA with her bank and are in the process of moving a large sum of money from her current account to her savings account as a damage limitation exercise. We want to limit the money that is linked to her debit card so she will not lose too much if she gets scammed over the phone. The bank agreed with this as a solution to our concerns.

We now need to stop her receiving statements as she has enough capacity to spot what we have done and she would not be happy! Unfortunately it appears we cannot arrange that online so I need to pop into her branch next week.

Her bank, Santander, have been brilliant and so far everything has gone well. All three attorneys have debit cards and will set up online banking ( as I also bank with them, I got access automatically) but mum still has her own card and cheque book - just with access to a lot less money! We have peace of mind as we can see how much cash she is getting out and hunt for it around the house to keep it safe!

We are attorneys jointly and severally so can act independently but we are in daily contact through Whatapp and trust each other implicitly.

The bank only needed the original LPA and proof of our identity or implement it, they copied the original while we were at the bank and I counted all the pages when we got it back!

 

[Sirena]

Th Halifax set up online banking for me when I went in with the LPA (my mother only had telephone banking). I then went home and set up a Halifax savings account for her and kept the majority of her money in that, transferring money each month cover bills and shopping (and, eventually, to pay for care). But unfortunately none of that will help cuddyduck if her mother insists on deregistering the LPA at the bank.

I sent my mother online shopping deliveries and fortunately she accepted them. However soon after I had to take over her finances she became unable to do daily tasks like make herself a cup of tea or a meal - she couldn't even toast a crumpet without incident. She hid this quite successfully for a while and said she didn't need any help. When I realised how bad it had got I arranged daily carers, which worked well for 18 months, but she's now in a (lovely) care home.

This is all stressful enough but made much worse if your PWD is not compliant.

 

[alc59]

As LPA I found it dead easy to set up a pockit debit card for my brother and to drip feed it from his main account to limit the potential damage from unwise actions. He's taken to it pretty well and I can monitor his spending as it happens.